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1990 MSU vs. Murray State

  • Achtung Baby said...

    He would have had to have been very young if he was on that team, because the Bennett led team that beat Cal was in 1994.

    Just looked. Bennett was on UWGB from 88-92

    F Michigan

    AASpartan

  • AASpartan said...

    Just looked. Bennett was on UWGB from 88-92

    So he was up against us. I wonder who they had in 94 when they took out J Kidd and Lamond Murray.

    Achtung Baby ●

  • AASpartan said...

    Just looked. Bennett was on UWGB from 88-92

    Ben Johnson was the defensive stopper on that team. Locked up Smith for almost the entire game. John martinez was Tonys backcourt mate. He was also very good. They also took Colemans Syracuse down to the wire the year they beat kidd and lamond Murrays cal.

    This post was edited by Chitown_Badger on 3/13/2012 at 11:07 PM

    Chitown_Badger

  • Achtung Baby said...

    So he was up against us. I wonder who they had in 94 when they took out J Kidd and Lamond Murray.

    I'm doing this from memory so may be Mixing teams but I remember Tony, John Martinez, Dean Vander Plas, Ben Johnson, and Jeremy ludvigson.

    Chitown_Badger

  • Chitown_Badger said...

    I'm doing this from memory so may be Mixing teams but I remember Tony, John Martinez, Dean Vander Plas, Ben Johnson, and Jeremy ludvigson.

    Well, they had Dick Bennett anyway. The savior of the Wisconsin basketball program wink_msu

    F Michigan

    AASpartan

  • Chitown_Badger said...

    Ben Johnson was the defensive stopper on that team. Locked up Smith for almost the entire game. John martinez was Tonys backcourt mate. He was also very good. They also took Colemans Syracuse down to the wire the year they beat kidd and lamond Murrays cal.

    Coleman finished his career at Syracuse in 1990. The Cal game was 94. They did lose to Cuse their next game.

    I looked up the Cal game. Jeff Nordgarrd, a 6-6 center, was the big scorer.

    Achtung Baby ●

  • AASpartan said...

    Well, they had Dick Bennett anyway. The savior of the Wisconsin basketball program wink_msu

    Dick and I went to uw the same year. People were really tore up when he left...Gb fans hated uw because they wouldn't play Gb when Tony was there. Dick started playing the other state schools regularly.

    Chitown_Badger

  • Achtung Baby said...

    Coleman finished his career at Syracuse in 1990. The Cal game was 94. They did lose to Cuse their next game.

    I looked up the Cal game. Jeff Nordgarrd, a 6-6 center, was the big scorer.

    Thanks for the correction. I misremembered,as I thought I might have.

    Nordgaard was really good. Caught on with the bucks for a while.

    This post was edited by Chitown_Badger on 3/13/2012 at 11:14 PM

    Chitown_Badger

  • Emerald Green said...

    In my opinion, this game is not talked about by the experts because of how that MSU was eventually knocked out of the tournament. The media does not like to talk about situations where incompetent officiating costs teams important games. In this case they would have to talk about the TWO times that Jud Heathcote teams won Sweet Sixteen games in regulation only to have those wins taken away by incompetent officials. In the 1986 incident, some officials lost their jobs and an entire arena was barred from ever holding an NCAA tournament game again until the situation was corrected. In both cases, NCAA rules were changed to prevent such incidents from ever occurring again. MSU has had long lasting effects on the NCAA Tournament, but MSU likely paid for that with lost Final Four appearances.

    If the media did like to talk about incompetent officiating, 5 downs to win a national title would be more well known than it is.

    This is all my opinion, and I could be wrong.

    In both games you reference, MSU had their best FT shooter at the line to ice both games away and missed the front end of 1 and 1's both times. While there sure was some incompetence with the refs and officials, we still had a great chance to win and advance, and we blew it both times.

    Spartan Punk ●

  • mentalstate said...

    Not too many 16 seeds have a legit NBA big man on their roster...

    That's to say, none have a big man that has gone on to play in the NBA for a decade.

    Larry Kazamias ●

  • Popeye fucking Jones. Thanks for bringing back bad memories.

    signature image

    mriderblue12 said... Your a retard.

    Watch Out Pylon

  • I remember that game very well. I remember in one of the press conferences before the game that Jud jokingly said "I'll tell you one thing, I guarantee MSU will win."

    He was obviously making a play on words with both schools being MSU, but the dipshit media ran with it and published that JUD HEATHCOTE GUARANTEES MICHIGAN STATE VICTORY.

    mudwhistle

  • Chilly said...

    Me and my friend were discussing the 15 seeds that have beaten a 2. I thought Princeton was one of them, and naturally googled it and came across the d1 basketball upsets wiki page. The first paragraph talks about how ETSU and Princeton both came within one point in 1989, and then this...

    Richmond beat Syracuse (1991?), Coppin State beat South Carolina in 1997,Hampton beat Iowa State (2001), Santa Clara over Arizona (1993, I think).

    Princeton was a 16 and missed a shot at the buzzer against Georgetown. That, ETSU, Western Carolina against Purdue and Murray State are the closest a 16 ever came to beating a 1.

    "If you have the right to be offended I have the right to offend you." - Ricky Gervais

    Enrico Palazzo

  • Watch Out Pylon said...

    Popeye fucking Jones. Thanks for bringing back bad memories.

    Yep, I remember LISTENING to that game in the electronics section at Meijer on Alpine in GR.

    I also remember crying like a little bitch even though I was 11 after the Kenny Anderson bullshit.

    Marriage is like flying with kids, if the flight had 500 connections, never ended, Ted Striker were your pilot and you ate the fish.

    Pylon St8ofmind ●

  • The memory that will live with fans from that tourney is definitely the GT game, not the Murray St game. It still pisses me off to this day. I remember sitting watching that game in real time and Anderson hoisting that shot, and saying to myself "that was clearly after the horn". Of course not only did the refs count it, but they went to the replay to see if it was a 3 and the game winner! Ugh. And the FF was well in our grasp, cause we had the Kevin Lynch and the Gophers waiting for us in the Elite Eight.

    SanJuan ●

  • AASpartan said...

    Kirk getting hurt during the season is probably one of the biggest reasons that we didn't go further in the tourney. People on here always dream about having a "pure shooter" on the team, but Kirk was so incredibly on that it was ridiculous. He shot over 50% from 3 his junior year. 47% his senior year. As good of a shooter and scorer that Shawn Respert was, Kirk's career 3pt% was better than Shawn's highest season%.

    Respert had all 5 opponents watching his every move. Manns was absolutely a pure shooter but he benefitted from the Smith double teams, drive and dish, and the nice inside out play with Pep and Stegeinga inside. A ton of non-contested shots. Love him as a shooter but the degree of difficulty between his shots and Respert's from deep is no comparison. Respert is the best 3-pt shooter MSU has ever had.

    Buzzer Beater ●

  • Buzzer Beater said...

    Respert had all 5 opponents watching his every move. Manns was absolutely a pure shooter but he benefitted from the Smith double teams, drive and dish, and the nice inside out play with Pep and Stegeinga inside. A ton of non-contested shots. Love him as a shooter but the degree of difficulty between his shots and Respert's from deep is no comparison. Respert is the best 3-pt shooter MSU has ever had.

    Shawn is my #2 favorite MSU player behind Steve Smith and he was at State when I was (even was in a COMM class with him). Not arguing about the greatness of Shawn Respert. He was essentially our whole team since Eric Snow pretty much mirrored Travis Walton at MSU (except that Eric has got to be the worst FT shooter ever).

    F Michigan

    AASpartan

  • AASpartan said...

    Shawn is my #2 favorite MSU player behind Steve Smith and he was at State when I was (even was in a COMM class with him). Not arguing about the greatness of Shawn Respert. He was essentially our whole team since Eric Snow pretty much mirrored Travis Walton at MSU (except that Eric has got to be the worst FT shooter ever).

    Respert is the best shooter I've ever seen at MSU who could get his own. Manns is the best shooter who could not.

    One shot to win it all with a clean look and I've never seen anybody at MSU I'd take over Manns. Maybe Lucious just because that kid was an absolute assassin late in games, but by far the best pure shooter would be Manns.

    I bet he would routinely make 85 out of 100 3s in practice.

    Marriage is like flying with kids, if the flight had 500 connections, never ended, Ted Striker were your pilot and you ate the fish.

    Pylon St8ofmind ●

  • AASpartan said...

    Shawn is my #2 favorite MSU player behind Steve Smith and he was at State when I was (even was in a COMM class with him). Not arguing about the greatness of Shawn Respert. He was essentially our whole team since Eric Snow pretty much mirrored Travis Walton at MSU (except that Eric has got to be the worst FT shooter ever).

    Snow actually improved tremendously as a FT shooter and actually averaged as high as 83% in the NBA. He was atrocious as a freshman but got up to 60% as a senior. Not good but it showed the work he put into it.

    "If you have the right to be offended I have the right to offend you." - Ricky Gervais

    Enrico Palazzo

  • I've always thought we've been incredibly lucky that this game doesn't come up regularly in the "16 never beats a 1" pre-tournament talk. Princeton is always more likely to be mentioned. Neither should have been 16 seeds, but they were, and regardless - even if they were as good as a 6 seed - they still didn't belong in a tie game with us.

    faygo ●

  • AASpartan said...

    Kirk getting hurt during the season is probably one of the biggest reasons that we didn't go further in the tourney. People on here always dream about having a "pure shooter" on the team, but Kirk was so incredibly on that it was ridiculous. He shot over 50% from 3 his junior year. 47% his senior year. As good of a shooter and scorer that Shawn Respert was, Kirk's career 3pt% was better than Shawn's highest season%.

    Manns' couldn't match Respert in one aspect: getting open. He was too slow. And that's why it was either hit or miss with him. Plus Jud had to play alot more zone with Manns in the game.

    UM, Green Bay and Chicago teams all have one thing in common: They all suck

    Clemenza

  • Game caused me to turn in a paper late. Luckily Prof. Dick Zinman was forgiving. Oh and screw Popeye Jones!

    signature image signature image signature image

    Madison1991

  • Pylon St8ofmind said...

    Respert is the best shooter I've ever seen at MSU who could get his own. Manns is the best shooter who could not.

    One shot to win it all with a clean look and I've never seen anybody at MSU I'd take over Manns. Maybe Lucious just because that kid was an absolute assassin late in games, but by far the best pure shooter would be Manns.

    I bet he would routinely make 85 out of 100 3s in practice.

    I might take Skiles over Manns -- hard to say for certain because Scotty played before there was a 3-point line. He used to throw some ridiculous shots through the hoop from waaaayyyyy downtown, though.

    signature image signature image signature image

    Here will be an old abusing of God's patience and the king's English

    Rule Spartannia

  • mudwhistle said...

    I remember that game very well. I remember in one of the press conferences before the game that Jud jokingly said "I'll tell you one thing, I guarantee MSU will win."

    He was obviously making a play on words with both schools being MSU, but the dipshit media ran with it and published that JUD HEATHCOTE GUARANTEES MICHIGAN STATE VICTORY.

    Funny, I was just telling a guy at work that story the other day! That's exactly how I remember it, too. They really fell for that one, hook line and sinker.

    And of all the MSU gut-wrenching defeats over the years, ND in football, Stanzi on the last play, etc., that Kansas game and that GT game are the two that I never really got over as a fan, that I am still bitter about to this day. I know I should just let them go, but the Spartans were really, truly, undeniably robbed both times. If Stanzi beats you, Stanzi beats you. But those two just sucked hard.

    MacSparty

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