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Bicyclers in vehicle lanes

  • Phil McCrackin said...

    I told you why. It's obvious that you're trolling. Hard.

    I'm not biting. Sorry.

    Explain to me how I'm trolling. Seriously.

    Colonel Forbin

  • Colonel Forbin said...

    You're in no danger of being banned, I'm not Tui.

    Being conservative, I'd say 80% of cyclists do not stop at red lights or four way stops in Philadelphia. I am not making this up. It's a concern for me because I've almost hit multiple cyclists at intersections. One was very close to being an incredibly severe accident. Look, I ride from time to time in the city. I'm aware of what it's like. But I don't try to weave through all the cars and blow through intersections. I've never honked at a cyclist or had road rage over a cyclist. I'm just trying to understand the behavior.

    And I don't know why my question still goes unanswered.

    Look, in Philly at least, it's not "some" refusing to stop, it's most. Cars do not blow through red lights and stop signs with the frequency cyclists do. Not here, at least. They just don't. And I still don't get the "well, motorists do this or that" in response to a question about cyclists.

    I gave you an honest answer, they are idiots. Because only an idiot would willfully and knowingly put themselves into a situation that could get them seriously injured or killed. That being said, I also think it comes down to the attitude of "my time is more valuable than yours", thus their need to cheat the system by not stopping and weaving in traffic to gain that extra 2 seconds. It may indeed be a large percentage of Philly bikers do it, but I am also positive it isn't all of them. Comparing cars to bicycles is valid because car drivers do run red lights and weave in and out of traffic. Idiocy doesn't belong in just one venue.

    Madhatter536

  • Colonel Forbin said...

    Let's be honest for a second here.

    Do some of you think the laws should be changed for cyclists so that they aren't required to stop at stop signs and red lights? Serious question.

    Hell no.

    Madhatter536

  • Colonel Forbin said...

    Let's be honest for a second here.

    Do some of you think the laws should be changed for cyclists so that they aren't required to stop at stop signs and red lights? Serious question.

    I believe in a few states a "rolling stop", similar to a Yield, is the law for bicycles at least at stop signs. I think Idaho was the first to adopt this idea. I agree with the view that this is safer based on many years and miles on a bike. Better to head into an intersection with at least a little momentum than from a dead stop.

    Stop lights are another matter.

    JLSparty

  • Colonel Forbin said...

    Explain to me how I'm trolling. Seriously.

    You've rode a bike in Philly and presumably encountered a few stop signs and red lights on your bike, so you either blew through every intersection you've encountered and know why you've done this, or you didn't blow through every intersection you encountered and can therefore represent at least 1 cyclist in Philly that does not ride like an idiot. Take your pick, either way you've proven you aren't likely to listen to any other viewpoint.

    Trolling = posting repeated incendiary/inflammatory statements in an effort to get people to argue with you. In this case, trolling is your insistence that EVERY SINGLE CYCLIST rides with COMPLETE DISREGARD to the rules of the road.

    Please don't ban me, I like posting on this site and will shut the hell up in this thread now.

    Phil McCrackin ●

  • Phil McCrackin said...

    Please don't ban me, I like posting on this site and will shut the hell up in this thread now.

    lol

    bulldogg

  • Madhatter536 said...

    I gave you an honest answer, they are idiots. Because only an idiot would willfully and knowingly put themselves into a situation that could get them seriously injured or killed. That being said, I also think it comes down to the attitude of "my time is more valuable than yours", thus their need to cheat the system by not stopping and weaving in traffic to gain that extra 2 seconds. It may indeed be a large percentage of Philly bikers do it, but I am also positive it isn't all of them. Comparing cars to bicycles is valid because car drivers do run red lights and weave in and out of traffic. Idiocy doesn't belong in just one venue.

    +1 for your honest and open interaction. I agree with pretty much everything you said. When I refer to weaving through traffic, I mean cyclists that squeeze through spots only they can get through from many, many car lengths back.

    I'm on the cyclists side when it comes to motorists. As a runner, I've been hit twice and had an instance where a driver who ran a very, very, very red light came inches away from creaming me at 50+ MPH.

    There are idiot drivers for sure. I encounter them every day. They usually have Jersey plates.

    Colonel Forbin

  • Colonel Forbin said...

    Let's be honest for a second here.

    Do some of you think the laws should be changed for cyclists so that they aren't required to stop at stop signs and red lights? Serious question.

    Serious answer, yes.

    Idaho law allows it. It looks like Oregon will be adopting it soon.

    CHAPTER 7
    PEDESTRIANS AND BICYCLES
    49-720. Stopping -- Turn and stop signals. (1) A person operating a bicycle or human-powered vehicle approaching a stop sign shall slow down and, if required for safety, stop before entering the intersection. After slowing to a reasonable speed or stopping, the person shall yield the right-of-way to any vehicle in the intersection or approaching on another highway so closely as to constitute an immediate hazard during the time the person is moving across or within the intersection or junction of highways, except that a person after slowing to a reasonable speed and yielding the right-of-way if required, may cautiously make a turn or proceed through the intersection without stopping.
    (2) A person operating a bicycle or human-powered vehicle approaching a steady red traffic control light shall stop before entering the intersection and shall yield to all other traffic. Once the person has yielded, he may proceed through the steady red light with caution. Provided however, that a person after slowing to a reasonable speed and yielding the right-of-way if required, may cautiously make a right-hand turn. A left-hand turn onto a one-way highway may be made on a red light after stopping and yielding to other traffic.

    FeMan

  • FeMan said...

    Serious answer, yes.

    Idaho law allows it. It looks like Oregon will be adopting it soon.

    CHAPTER 7 PEDESTRIANS AND BICYCLES 49-720. Stopping -- Turn and stop signals. (1) A person operating a bicycle or human-powered vehicle approaching a stop sign shall slow down and, if required for safety, stop before entering the intersection. After slowing to a reasonable speed or stopping, the person shall yield the right-of-way to any vehicle in the intersection or approaching on another highway so closely as to constitute an immediate hazard during the time the person is moving across or within the intersection or junction of highways, except that a person after slowing to a reasonable speed and yielding the right-of-way if required, may cautiously make a turn or proceed through the intersection without stopping. (2) A person operating a bicycle or human-powered vehicle approaching a steady red traffic control light shall stop before entering the intersection and shall yield to all other traffic. Once the person has yielded, he may proceed through the steady red light with caution. Provided however, that a person after slowing to a reasonable speed and yielding the right-of-way if required, may cautiously make a right-hand turn. A left-hand turn onto a one-way highway may be made on a red light after stopping and yielding to other traffic.

    Ah yes, the good ol' "Dead Red" laws. I love those. A very good thing when you come across a random stoplight in the middle of BFE with no traffic around.

    tRCMB - Visit at your own risk of being disgusted.

    Gob_Bluth ●

  • FeMan said...

    Serious answer, yes.

    Idaho law allows it. It looks like Oregon will be adopting it soon.

    CHAPTER 7 PEDESTRIANS AND BICYCLES 49-720. Stopping -- Turn and stop signals. (1) A person operating a bicycle or human-powered vehicle approaching a stop sign shall slow down and, if required for safety, stop before entering the intersection. After slowing to a reasonable speed or stopping, the person shall yield the right-of-way to any vehicle in the intersection or approaching on another highway so closely as to constitute an immediate hazard during the time the person is moving across or within the intersection or junction of highways, except that a person after slowing to a reasonable speed and yielding the right-of-way if required, may cautiously make a turn or proceed through the intersection without stopping. (2) A person operating a bicycle or human-powered vehicle approaching a steady red traffic control light shall stop before entering the intersection and shall yield to all other traffic. Once the person has yielded, he may proceed through the steady red light with caution. Provided however, that a person after slowing to a reasonable speed and yielding the right-of-way if required, may cautiously make a right-hand turn. A left-hand turn onto a one-way highway may be made on a red light after stopping and yielding to other traffic.

    Too bad a number of cyclists will interpret that law to mean they can blow through residential intersections without even slowing down, like they do all the time here in Evanston, IL. In my own experience, cyclists here have run stop signs about 8 times out of 10. If I see one coming when I'm stopped at a 4 way stop I pretty much assume I'll have to wait for them to speed on through before I can continue.

    DaHorn_Spartan

  • Colonel Forbin said...

    Let's be honest for a second here.

    Do some of you think the laws should be changed for cyclists so that they aren't required to stop at stop signs and red lights? Serious question.

    Many people noted it already, but the yield-stop/stop-red light is a good idea. It allows law abiding cyclists to clear an intersection before the mass movement of a light change.

    Also if you are really intrested in big city cycling views check out the blog bike snob new York city. Maybe it will give you a better view of what a frequent cyclist deals with both from asshole cars and asshole bikers. Plus he is prety funny.

    This post was edited by MadMaxim on 5/15/2012 at 9:00 PM

    Bike Snob NYC

    http://bikesnobnyc.blogspot.com/

    bikesnobnyc.blogspot.com

    MadMaxim

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