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Not yet, well find out in June or so, but despite not being a retard, I read ATL from time to time and a buddy of mine who just graduated from law school but went to UIowa undergrad sent it to me originally.
Fine excuse if the Detroit College of Law existed in New York City, Washington, DC, or another city that was thriving.
Wayne State was a pretty good school back when Detroit had jobs, based solely on location.
I don't see how anyone could respectably dedicate years of their life, much less money, to an education at this college.
This post was edited by 100 Green22663 16 months ago
I'm not necessarily arguing and for me it wouldn't be a good option but Lansing still has state govt. and no one in NYC or DC. Is getting a biglaw job coming out of Catholic (also 80) or prolly even American and maybe Mason. I gotta think if the best place u can go is MSU and you want to be a lawyer you have a relatively decent shot at a law job at least in MI. But I've never really looked at that market of MSU's employment data so I'm just spitballing.
why are lawyers, aspiring and practicing, so shitty about the law schools outside the top 5?
"bzzzzzzzzzzz bzbzbzbbzbz" - bees
Like holding a wolf by the ears man. Everyone knows the status quo is kinda fucked but no one dares let go either.
I had always heard that Cooley went to MSU to try to partner up, I guess thinking that the MSU name would help their rep; and MSU said no, we're not interested. I have no way of verifying if that is true, and it probably isn't. Just what I had been told a while ago.
Between my degree certificate, my last transcript, my letter announcing my graduation, and a couple of other items you receive when you are gradutating, I have at least three versions of the name on different documents all dated within a year time span.
My firm has a pretty good mix between UM, MSU, and Wayne, with a few ND, UDM and "other" tossed in. UM is probably the single largest, but not by much. I've not ran a head count. MSU Law is a very good school. Certainly UM is as well and I think Wayne is. They are all a bit different in who the students are and thus what their focus is. MSU has been and is trying to really focus on practice ready attorneys. UM is much more theory based, which is great for a large firm where you spend your first five years just doing research or writting memos, not so much if you actually need to practice right away.
IMO, most of the top law firms are a waste unless you have serious political aspirations, are dead set on working in a 1000+ firm, or your looking for a some government or exec job outside of law. Of course, most of these rolls also require current connections or unual opportunities to present themselves.
Dean Asswipe..........hope not.
I just looked at the rankings and damn law school has gotten expensive. I graduated from OSU 8 years ago and the cost has doubled. 42K a year for out of state? Ouch.
I don't know, I spent years of time and money at MSU COL and am extremely pleased with my career. I have a job I enjoy in good firm doing work I find rewarding and interesting. But I don't work for a NY silk stocking firm. I guess it is what is important to you. I am very happy with my choice in going to MSU COL.
Because a significant number of lawyers are elitist pricks.
I too went to MSU law and enjoyed it.. Felt it provided a good education and I was able to earn a scholarship which greatly defrayed the cost..
Passed the bar with ease the first time around. I'm not flying around in private jets, but I'm doing better than I would have with an undergrad poly-sci degree..
Not to hijack the thread but....MSU Law is $36k a year? I went to Wayne from 01-04 for...I shit you not...$24k total...for three years. You would have to have rocks in your head to pay that much for a law degree that didn't say "Harvard" on it.
While some MSU law graduates may have successful careers, many (most) do not. Look at the real employment statistics, less than 40% of grads have legal jobs of any sort. If that doesn't make MSU law a TTT, I don't know what would.
This post was edited by n106644 16 months ago
"Victory or Death : Either With Your Shield or On It"
These "law grads end up regretting it" threads used to stress me out when I was in law school. But then I graduated from my tier 4 school and got a great job that I love... in Michigan. Now they don't bother me as much.
That is a report of full-time, long-term legal jobs, except solos. Of course solo attorneys make up the vast majority of attorneys, but let's ignore them. And, there is always a large number of people who don't work in "legal jobs", which is not defined but I'll guess that it does not include in-house, government, and other jobs that may not be law firm but for which the employee became employed in large part due to the law degree.
I.E. the data is not defined well enough to be of any use.
God damn it, Roushar.
Current Wayne State Law tuition is $851 / credit hour in state. At 81 Credits that is a total tuition (no fees or living costs) of $68,931.
So, either you are mis-remembering your costs, you had schollys or other aid, or Wayne State has had huge increases in their costs.
Well it's the only real data available, and it's downright frightening.
28 UM grads took the Michigan bar in July last year, out of ~380 total, so not very many.
Again, what is the point of information when you are missing most of it? Even by their charts, only 11.7% are unemployed, which is a lot better than you were protraying above and not to terribly for new law grads in this current depression in the legal field. I also don't know why they publish salary reports is the majority of people did not respond. And yet, even with those that did not respond, who likely are the higher paid group, the 50 percentile of a new grad is $60k, again not to shabby for a 23 year old.
EDIT: did not see this page: Half of the 11.7% unemployed are unemployed by choice and are still in a grad program. So, true umemployed is under 6%.
This post was edited by Rook 16 months ago
Short term/part time is nearly as bad as unemployed, and spending $200k on a degree with extremely questionable prospects is probably a bad idea. People with higher salaries are more likely to report salaries in the first place, and 60k as the 50th percentile seems nice, but when 40% report salaries, I would be careful thinking that most MSU law grads make 60k. Keep in mind that most of these grads will have $100-200k in debt, so that $60k seems a lot smaller than it otherwise would.
I graduated with $150k in debt, plus my wife (married shortly after graduation) had another $35k. I was making $60k at my first gig. The money was more than enough for a young couple with no kids. Ten years later I'm doing much better, but of course with kids and other obligations. And, there is no such thing as a "long-term" job anymore. If you think your boss has loyalty to keep you, think again.
Regarding the reporting numbers, I don't know anyone who makes less than $60k, including many solo's I know, most of whom make a fair bit more than I do. Being an attorney can be a great profession and you can make as much money as you want. Sure there are risks taking on the debt. If you are looking for a low risk, high reward job making $100k just out of school, I'm sorry to have to be the one to disappoint you.
Believe what you want, but going to law school is still one of the better opportunities out there and certainly is does not have "extremely questionabel prospects".
"Nothing will ever be attempted, if all possible objections must first be overcome." Samuel Johnson, Rasselas, 1759.
My buddy who just graduated Yale is doing a fellowship on The Hill, he's technically not employed doing legal work... nevermind he's doing a fellowship for Senate Judiciary.
Data is data. Obviously there's a glut of people graduating from Law School and a lot of old ass lawyers are not retiring and people are backing down how much legal services and lawyers they need but the data gets skewed in a lot of ways both good and bad.
Everyone knows taking huge debt, in a market that's as saturated at he legal one is, is a risk, but if you want to be a lawyer you don't have many options. You just gotta do as well as you can on the LSAT and decide what your best Law School option is and how badly you want it and do it if you want to do it.
All the shitting on law school is getting tired and has really jumped the shark for me. Going to a shitty medical school is just as risky and so is getting an MBA or really any other additional degree outside of engineering or nursing, and even with nursing most of the jobs are in places that suck ass anyway.
So in short. +1, meant to quote your last post btw instead of this one.
This post was edited by JMCSpartan08 16 months ago
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