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No one said he completed his goal, who said I said that?
Point being, last season proved MSU isn't very close to being a top 10 or 15 program. Better programs are generally able to handle the turnover that is college football. My feeling is we have an O staff that is missing one or more of the pieces needed to move the program to the next level, with or w/o talent.
Jesus you're annoying.
I know people are going to say I'm a nancy, a chicken little, not a true Spartan, etc, but it's almost impossible to see myself getting excited at all for MSU football next year if Roushar is back. I won't be rooting for them any less and I will still watch all the games, because I am a true Spartan, but I feel like it would be best to hope for the best but expect the worst if Roushar is back.
People who are apologists for him simply don't understand the damage he is doing, in fact the damage may already be done. I really hope it isn't.
That's true, but the defense has not suffered the catastrophic injuries we've seen on the offensive line. Sure, we've had an injury here or there, but not nearly in the numbers seen by the offense.
And it is also true that we can't say for sure that the line will be any better next year. That being said, if you look at trends, having a line that has more seniors and juniors starting historically means the likelihood of improvement is greater than not.
Better annoying than stupid like you.
I don't think it is an "apologist" stance to ask for patience with Roushar. The stuff people are saying about him are the EXACT same things being said about Treadwell when he was a coordinator. By the time he left the program, those same people were wondering what we were foing to do without him.
Quite frankly, the poor execution by a bunch of inexperienced players not quite ready for primetime makes it impossible to truly evaluate him. Especially after his offense performed so well last year with veterans.
Personally, I don't think he's a bad coordinator, but he's certainly not great. He's an average coordinator. Which isn't the end of the world. As the overwhelming majority of coordinators are just that. The ones that are great don't stsy coordinators long as they become head coaches.
I don't remember Treadwell being even close to as bad as Roushar.
Not sure what the stats say though.
Well here are the stats for the Treadwell's first two years and the Roushar years averaged out.
Points per game
Yards per carry
Yards per pass attempt
It's actually pretty equal.
I think everyone blames the OC when the offense isn't working because they overvalue their teams players. Its hard to open up the playbook when your players can't even execute more basic things.
Hammer meet nail. That doesn't mean Roushar is without fault, but he isn't the scapegoat some make him out to be.
Agree 100 percent. Dantonio needed to make a move at the end of this season, but didn't. The program will pay dearly.
My excitement lies with the possibility the offense can pull a "Cousins" and win despite a horrible offensive coordinator.
Well, Treadwell's teams scored 4.2 more points a game while having less talent and not getting the ball back as quickly from the defense.
I sure wish we had scored 4.2 more points per game this year. We'd probably be in the Rose Bowl.
You can come up with statistics for anything. 60% of people know that.
Seriously though, good to see Tread and Roushar compared with data, rather than fanatical opinion.
Hey there, don't use facts!
This post was edited by Izzo Court 19 months ago
Good point. We need to see average points per game divided by average time of possession per game or some such normalizer.
This post was edited by jimmyarr127 19 months ago
Texas, UM, ND, USC, OSU, Bama pre Saban, FSU last few years of Bowden, etc... I can go on and on, Teams have down years. Texas, UM, OSU and Bama pre Saban have all had 6 loss years recently.
We are MSU. Until we have 10 years of success as those teams all have had we can't afford to become irrelevant for a year or two. We must have continued success.
Here's another stat, redzone percentage ...
Treadwell's first two seasons:
2007: 85.96 (32nd)
2008: 82.22 (60th)
Roushar's first two seasons:
2011: 84.31 (47th)
2012: 78.05 (83rd)
Keep in mind that RZ% maybe flawed, but it is "tempo free".
This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by SpartanGop 19 months ago
A closer look at points ...
Treadwell's first two seasons:
2007: 33.1 (24th)
2008: 25.1 (57th) (A step back, but still average)
Roushar's first two seasons:
2011: 31.2 (32nd) (This offense had Kirk Cousins, BJC, KMart, Nichol, Bell, Baker, Sims, etc.)
2012: 20.2 (104th)
Just pull a "Cousins"?
Or do we need to pull a "Cousins", "Martin", "Cunningham", "Nichol", and "Linthicum"?
I just want our program to pull a Roushar, from the payroll.
Did those offenses really have less talent? Ringer, Caulcrick, Dell, Thomas, Hoyer, White, Cunningham, Martin, and Davis all made NFL rosters and played in either 2007 or 2008. That group stacks up pretty much equal to the talent we were putting on the field in 2011 and 2012.
Yup. I think it's more maxwell than Dan. The plays are there maxwell has no touch at all. He can't float the ball in there like cousins could. Maxwell overthrows 90% of his deep balls. Not accurate. Misses easy slants repeatedly to stall drives. Terrible in the red zone. Need to replace him.
This post was edited by Tanfan 19 months ago
Keeping the sunshiners in check since 2000.
The situations where Dantonio would fire a coach from his staff before the bowl game are ones I don't want to consider, because it means they did something really fucking bad.
Maybe he fires Roushar after the bowl game, maybe he doesn't, but Dantonio does not strike me as the kind of guy to want to replace coaching staff during bowl practices.
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