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You right away pick up on the raburn, kelly,santiago, and inge with their present ages.........the point is they were in the system since their mid 20's. Anyway, I digress. Besides Verlander, can you point out a pitcher after 4 years who went down a positive path? In the Tiger organization? Just curious why you seem so smitten with Porcello.
SIAP, but have people talked about Melky Cabrera?
In the Tigers organization?! Few. Last decade or so...Verlander obviously, Rodney to a degree, Porcello. Lots of promise de-railed by injury...Bonderman, Zumaya. Good trades to get talent though from other teams...pitchers at that point in their career where a bit of experience needs to meet that next level. Gave up true prospects without much of a MLB track record to get them. But I don't think you're advocating trading pitchers simply because the Tigers have a poor track record of player development.
But you continue to miss the point. I'm not "smitten" with Porcello. What I don't think is that "Smyly can easily take that slot" so let's just dump the "peaked" Porcello for whatever some team will offer. Don't be a "Tom from Royal Oak." Porcello is young. Yes, expendable if the Tigers sign Sanchez, but you're wrong to think he doesn't have excellent trade value given what he's done by the age of 23....4 years, 170+ innings each year, mid-4 ERA, 48 wins, winning record, etc. His contract is also held by the Tigers until 2016. That's valuable in a trade, and if the team cannot re-up Sanchez, it's an equally easy choice to put him at 4, Smyly at 5, and think that's more than enough to get to the post-season. Yes, he needs to progress, much like every other 23-year old pitcher in the game.
The Tigers are in a great position....a young pitcher with experience and a decent MLB record at 23. If he's the #4 starter next year, OK. The team will need more from him in that role. If Sanchez is back and they float Porcello on the market, he has far more value than many on this board think. Fans often miss the big picture. Encouraging the idea that Porcello be viewed for what he is, and not through the prism of the frustrated radio caller, isn't exactly the start of a Porcello fan club......
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind." --Gandhi
You sure dead on. The biggest thing most fans screw up on when talking about starting pitchers is that they expect a rotation full of 20 game winners and that just doesn't happen. It's like asking your #8 hitter to lead the league in home runs. Fans need the ability to evaluate a pitcher based on where he is in the rotation. If a team gets 15 wins each out of its #1 and #2 starters, 12 wins out of your #3 guy, and 10 wins each from the #4 and #5 slots then that team is a 62 win, .500 ball club even before you factor in wins from your bullpen. That team is going to compete for playoff spots EVERY year.
Porcello having been paid only $7M total over the last four years has averaged 12 wins a year from the #4 slot. Other teams would KILL for that type of production, for that price, from that spot in rotation. You just don't see it often.
Porcello is not a great pitcher by any means. But for the money, he is a great value at this point in his career. He's never going to be a great pitcher, but at 23, he still has time to become a good pitcher. It's certainly worth keeping around as he has value to your team and/or on the trade market. I certainly wouldn't give him away.
Heck, even if they sign Sanchez, I would make him my #5 starter and use Smyly as a long reliever.
Is any team really going to give him more PT (63 games) than he got in Detroit?
Guy already has his ring (with the 2011 Cardinals.)
Guess he just wants to play more?
I don't begrudge him for that. Would be nice to have him back but I understand if he wants to go elsewhere.
G mo $
Better do some more ciphering.......62 wins isn't .500.
Smyly as a starter, and a lhp, is a nice balance to an all rh rotation. Smyly 'easily put into the rotation' was not stated as an automatic, unless he continues to shine in the spring. Porcello was originally thought of as potential trade bait, not just to dump him, or give up on him. If he wins a starting position in the spring, then fine.......WE ARE JUST HYPOTHESIZING. I am just not afraid to package him, right now, for a prospect or two in a position of need. Why? Because of Smyly, and if we get his signature on a contract, Sanchez. And Porcello RIGHT NOW IS A 5B; Smyly was the more effective 5th starter at the end of the season.
I love how you embellish a point in order to spin an opposing view. Porcello at best, is a 5th starter for the Tigers. With the development of Smyly, he becomes expendable to a team(which is most teams) that needs a 3rd -5th starter. He has great value RIGHT NOW. Young. Potential. And it helps that Smyly is a lefty since we have an all righty rotation.
Close. I think Porcello is right now, at best, a 4th starter on this team without Sanchez. That's the multi-million dollar question. Sign him, and yes, Porcello becomes valuable in a different sense. Smyly is far from a known quantity though and it'd be ideal to have some cover for that role. No Sanchez, it's Porcello and Smyly. Sign Sanchez and it makes sense to explore options. It really does all come down to whether they can get Sanchez to return, doesn't it?! And in the grand scheme of the game, these are rich team problems.......
Did I really see that KC traded for Ervin Santana after his 13 million option was exercised?
oops...don't know how I did that one. In my defense, I think I'm coming down with something so I'm not fully up to speed.
Other than I screwed up in factoring percentages, what's wrong with my point. He's pitched pretty well for what you expect out of a 4th or 5th starter.
And by the way...the Tigers go 63 wins from their starting pitchers this year. How many wins did I say you needed from your starters to put you clearly in the hunt for the playoffs...62. I think my point still is relevant regardless of whether you want to hear it or not.
This post was edited by wingfanjim 18 months ago
Legendary Lloyd interviewed for the Marlins job yesterday.
I don't disagree ... just not sure that he would get any more playing time elsewhere.
Nick Castellanos will play in AFL Rising Stars Game on Sat. 11/3 at 8 p.m. The game will air on MLB Network.
One writer's predictions on where the Top 50 FA's wind up.
4. Anibal Sanchez - Tigers. Sanchez, 29 in February, has been a dependable number two or three starter over the past three years. He capped off his 2012 resume with a successful American League stint and 20 strong playoff innings. A C.J. Wilson-type contract seems fair. The Tigers have interest in bringing Sanchez back, though the Blue Jays, Yankees, Twins, Angels, Rangers, Dodgers, and Padres are among the teams that may make bids if he hits the open market. Unlike Kyle Lohse, Sanchez will not cost a draft pick to sign.
36. Ryan Madson - Tigers. I applauded the Reds for pulling off the impossible last offseason: signing an elite, relatively young Boras client coming off a strong season to a one-year deal. Then Madson missed the entire season with Tommy John surgery. The 32-year-old is in line for another one-year deal, and could solidify the back end of the Tigers' bullpen.
This post was edited by WBill19542 17 months ago
1) Re-sign Anibal Sanchez. Having 4 starters all in their primes is a great way to ensure that you stay in World Series contention.
2) Corner Outfielder. Someone proven who gets on base and plays good defense. Need reliable production here. Speed is a plus.
3) Another proven BP arm. I think most of the Tiger resources (FA/Trades) will go towards Anibal and a corner OF. As of now I don't see the Tigers signing a guy for $8M+ annually to close games. Possibly someone like Madson/Soria. I think acquiring a plyer like that plus Benoit, Albuquerque, Dotel, Rondon, Coke, Villarreal, Smyly or Porcello (whomever is not starting?), Downs, Below, Marte will give the team enough options to head into the season with confidence
4) If Laird is indeed out - i think the Tigers need to acquire a legitimate backup catcher and not rely on Holaday stepping up. First, I'm not sure how good Holaday even is but regardless it is too risky with the beating Avila takes each year. Need to acquire someone proven here.
5) Maybe some type of legitimate bench piece. Maybe a middle infielder? Santiago and Worth are still there obviously. Will Boesch still be here? I think Berry earns a role. Kelly? Like to get at least 1 new piece instead of relying on the same guys every year.
I agree its down on the priority list but they really need some pieces on the bench that bring more than .170 averages with no power.
Kelly declined his assignment to Toledo and is now a Free Agent. I would expect some National League team might be interested.
Lot of talk( smoke screen maybe) about taking a real good look at Rondon as a possible closer. Guy has reportedly been able to reach 103, and hits 100 consistantly. Just wonder how effective he is getting his curveball across, to keep guys from sitting on that heater.
I would like to see the Tigers come up with a package to get Upton over here, not sure what that would entail.
Sounds like Sanchez is going to be targeted by the Tigers to keep here, great idea.
Ditto. It was unfortunate that Santiago had a "lost" season. He was pretty reliable the previous seasons. Not sur ehow much they are counting on him.
We've had some good players develop under DD's tenure but how is it that we have not had a single 2B/SS prospect worth starting? The guy with the most hype, I think, was Scott Sizemore and, he was shipped like a month into last season. Not even 1 player?
Sanchez is not worth Cj Wilson money. Tigers will let him go elsewhere if that's the case. I'd rather go after Bourn and slide Jackson down in order
CJ Wilson wasn't either but players get overpaid in the market.
Great. Let some other team give him that $$$
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