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I heard a better compairson of Rivals * ratings. When you sign a player, you hope that they will be a starter by this time....
5* = Starter as a True FR
4* = Starter as a RS FR
3* = Starter as a RS So
2* = Starter as a RS Ju
1* = Starter as a RS Senior
FWIW, the lowest I've ever seen someone rated was a 2-star. I suppose the transfers should be 0 stars then. Definitely changes the outlook.
Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.
I'd change that slightly, since most guys, even 5-stars, have some trouble adjusting their first year. By that definition, Gholston would be a 4-star (starter his 2nd year) and Cousins a 3-star (started his RS Soph year). I think we can agree that they deserve a 5-star and a 4-star rating respectively.
I generally think that the 5-stars/high 4-stars are starters by their 2nd year on campus and the low 4-stars/high 3-stars are in the 2-deeps by then. I also think their overall production matters, which is what put BJ into 4-star status; it's hard to ignore a 1300 yard, 12 TD year for a WR in a pro-style O.
BUT YOURE USING RIVALS RANKINGS RIVALZ SUX 247 HURR DERRRRRR.
Especially given that most 5-star linemen do not start their true freshmen year nor do 5-star QBs.
Looking over that list of names brings back memories. I recall everyone being so excited at getting Martin, D'Imperio and SirDarean.
Don't forget how excited people were to steal Carl Grimes from FSU on signing day
2005 was nuts too. Bobby Jones was a bust, Kerry Reed was solid as a WR, but after that . . .
Well, Javon Ringer kinda helped a bit from that group, but you'll see some back-ups and very few starters. KDC, Nitchman, Cironi and Wiley, along with Ringer, are the only multi-year starters from that group. St. Dic's ridiculous 2007 definitely helps him, but in terms of guys you can build a successful team around . . . yeesh.
Sidenote: JLS kind of screwed State by not RSing Brandon Long and Ryan Allison. Allison had made some pretty big plays at OLB in 2008, his true SR year, and Long had 5.5 sacks that season at DE. If MSU had had both back in 2009, maybe the D wouldn't have been quite so awful; Long would have at least given MSU SOME semblance of a pass rush, and Allison could have filled that 3rd LB void instead of sticking an over-his-head Norman in there along with Misch.
Check the OP. It's confusing enough as it is; it'd be worse if I tried to translate Rivals #s into 247's scale of rankings. I'm sticking with Rivals till the 2011 class uses its eligibility up for the purposes of looking back.
Good stuff Rocky. Can't wait to see the 2010 version of this.
Awesome job Rocky. I wish someone did this for the Michigan site. Heck I may start putting it together just to throw it out there.
The goal is to have them start by that point. So when you see a 3*, you hope he'll be starting, or seeing significent playing time by RS Soph year. That being said, the thing is screwed for a lot of the skill positions.
Of course, the more I think of it, the more I think I made a mistake. It may have been
5* = Start by Frosh
4* = Start by Sophomore
3* = Junior
2* = Senior
and RSing is implied.
2010 is going to be pretty crazy. So far Gholston, Bullough, Lewis and Burkland look to be living up to their billing . . . and Rush, Lippett, Bell, Dennard and Jackson could join them. I could see Mumphrey, Drummond and ARW making a leap too, depending on how their career's finish.
All in all, 2010 looks like it's the best class of the MD era in terms of production, and they've only been on campus for 2 years .
It really stems from our talks on the blue board when comparing the "talent" between our two teams. Basically counting Cousins/Bell/Cunningham/Foreman as 3/2-stars was under-rating MSU's talent, so I started thinking about doing a look back and see where these guys "really" ended up.
Again, this is totally my opinion and should not be considered anything other than a fun diversion. It'll be interesting to see how MD's talent rises over the next few classes (2008-2010); I think there is a definite uptick in talent from 2009-forward.
FWIW, this probably explains the 2009 season better than anything; MD's first 2 classes produced a total of 11 "stud" players, all of whom were in their 2nd or 3rd year on campus in '09. The '09 class were all true FR. If you look at the '05 and '06 classes, the # of guys left to be RS JR/SRs were few and far between.
It also highlights why I believe MSU is not going to fall off anytime soon. The '09-'10 classes were true JRs through RS FR last season, meaning they're really coming into their own in '12 and '13. If the '11 class is anything like the '10 class, State should be among the contenders for the Legends division for the next few years.
You have to look at their impact also. That would make Desmond Morgan, Jaked Ryan, and Blake Countess, 5 *'s for Michigan last year. They were all starters with Morgan and Countess being true freshmen.
Yea, to me a 5-star isn't just a 4-year starter (See Foreman, Joel), but rather a multi-year starter who is recognized among the best nationally at his position. That's why even though Greg Jones didn't have NFL measurables, he was a 5-star college player; 2 time All-American, 3 time All B1G, B1G D POY, etc.
It's a sliding scale, of course; if Gholston ends up as a 1st team-AA player at DE, then goes pro, I think you can still call him a 5-star player, even though he was only in school for 2 years.
This post was edited by MalibuMan 2 years ago
What are these new star rankings relative to?
Dell ended up behind Cunningham but I would still consider him a 4 star.
I AM KIND, SMART, POWERFUL, BEAUTIFUL, TERRIFIC, AND TREMENDOUS
College performance with no consideration for "pro potential".
I'd probably have Foreman as a borderline 3/4, and I'd say it'd be hard not to have KC as a 5*. He did just about everything you could at MSU, was 4-0 against UM as a player and won a bowl game against an SEC school. Could be a second round pick...I'd say it's very close.
So refreshing to have a well thought out post around here where way too many posts are pure trash and suffer from the inability to think and express thoughts clearly. Great job!
Career backups should be one stars all day.
Thank you for your well thought out post
Great thread Rocky.
Gotta give Cousin's at least a 6.0..... 3 year captain, leader in almost all statistical categories and has won the most in school history.
Naw, leadership which I think will carry weight for years to come, makes him a 6.1 five star. The win against GA puts it over the top for me. That game was the D and Kirk Cousins. Kirk was instrumental in getting us over Rather Hall. Getting together with BJ and Dell. Helping to keep it together and look how it worked out.
Also agree guys like Leggett and Duran who did nothing after leaving do not deserve 2 * ratings.
I have always wondered how Wilson would have performed if he had a senior year push.
I agree that a player should be judged on how well he played in college. But I feel like if they get drafted in the NFL or they make it via free agency, I think that player should be rewarded at least a 4 star.
In contrast, I do think Foreman deserved a 4 star ranking. Even though he won't make it in the NFL, without doubt, he was initially underrated. The guy had heart, leadership and a lot of skill. The only reason he won't "make in the NFL" is only for the fact that he left everything out on field for 4 years and his body took too much of a beating. Great Spartan and great guy.
This post was edited by One Eyed Jack 2 years ago
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