Online Now 1484

MSU Red Cedar Message Board

The largest and most active MSU Spartans board on the web

Online now 1842
Record: 10351 (3/11/2012)

Boards ▾

MSU Red Cedar Message Board

The largest and most active MSU Spartans board on the web

The Press Box

The place to ask questions to SpartanTailgate's recruiting experts

Duffy Daugherty Forum

"The Duff" is dedicated to Michigan State football recruiting discussion

Jack Breslin Forum

"The Bres" is dedicated to Michigan State basketball recruiting discussion

Wells Hall Off Topic Board

This is your pulpit to preach to the masses about everything from politics to religion

Marketplace & Ticket Exchange

The place to buy, trade or sell Michigan State tickets

Fantasy Sports Forum

For fantasy football and other fantasy sports discussion

Test/Feedback Forum


Sports are now a civil right for the disabled (US Dept. of Ed)

  • Give me one example of this happening.

    signature image
  • U of M's Athletic Department has been giving disabled people the chance to play sports for years. I would know.


    Brent Petway

  • Well, here's what I know. In the early to mid-2000s to at least 2008, and maybe through today, Williams College in Williamstown, Massachusetts, did something similar. There were no scholarships, technically, for athletics. However, if you were a low skill hockey or softball player and could otherwise meet the minimum standards for admission, you easily got an "academic" scholarship which continued as long as you played the sport.

    There is a similar situation at many colleges and universities, which are not D1 schools for the very most part.

    So, it isn't like these girls never played the sport before, but there skill level in the sport was such that they were not even regular starters on their high school team. You or I could watch them play and, objectively, you would not be the least bit impressed. The specific girls I was familiar with at this time were not even dedicated athletes for the most part.

    To your point, I can only say I seem to recall anecdotal evidence that during the years immediatly following passage of Title IX, some colleges and universities were, literally, recruiting any women with interest to join the varsity rowing team or field hockey team or whatever, which were created to comply with Title IX, in order to get participation level and scholarships where they had to be. Those stories were in the news around that time (early 1990s). As "they" say, you could look it up.

    Edit: Here's some evidence on the ESPNW site, below. Scroll down to the post by Ross Ciprianno, for what it's worth.

    This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by BillOGoods 15 months ago

  • The students do have the opportunity to participate, they can go out for the team. That doesn't mean they are guaranteed to make the team. Also, nobody said school was all about sports. Your attempts at obfuscation won't go unchallenged here.

    Some of us did mention Special Olympics and the good that it does, some of us have volunteered, and I have an Autistic sister that competed in Special Olympics when she was very young, so spare me your over-inflated sense of moral superiority. You stand on your pedestal of righteous indignation demanding equal access for those not fortunate enough to be gifted with the attributes needed to SAFELY compete at the level required, while negligently ignoring their safety. It appears that you harbor a misguided belief that they will just be happy to participate and everyone else will voluntarily drop their level of performance at all times to keep the competition fair and the feel-good moments abundant. Once reality sets in and you see that nobody is giving them the feel-good moments you envisioned, and you realize that they can't compete, and their self esteem is getting shredded, or worse, that they are getting seriously injured, then what?

    I suspect that your reaction would be an emotional one, just like the emotional reaction evidenced by your post. I suspect you would demand rule changes that forcibly drag the achievers down to the level of the non-achievers so you can create the emotional feel-good moments that form the basis of a twisted morality, a morality based solely on who you feel more sorry for at any given moment and one that ignores the fact that you provide the feel-good moments for the few at the expense of the feel-good moments for the many. If you failed at that, then I suspect that you would demand a separate program, ignoring the basic fact that there just aren't that many handicapped people in any given school to create a viable program for them and also ignoring the damage you do to the existing programs by diverting funding to something that nobody except the parents of the handicapped child want to watch on a regular basis.

    As a family with an Autistic child we joined Special Olympics so she could compete at a level that was safe for her without taking precious resources from others or dragging them down to her level to do it. Our sense of fairness and morality doesn't require others to sacrifice their desires to satisfy ours. Yours, on the other hand, appears to require the opposite.

    The only thing disgusting about this thread is your participation in it.

    This post was edited by Code_Warrior 15 months ago

    signature image signature image

    Give them NOTHING but take from them EVERYTHING.

  • Even if this happened when Title IV was first passed, I see no problem with it. The opportunity was desired result, not the initial skill level.

    The reverse is actually now the problem. American girls now have more limited opportunities that just a few years ago. In Golf, Tennis, Swimming and Diving, Field Hockey, and Soccer, coaches are recruiting globally for a competitive edge and passing on less talented girls from the states. Right or wrong, US college coaches in women's tennis field entire squads of foreign born players. Is that the desired result we were looking for?

    Tennis...from the attached link...
    "Among the top 25 women teams in Division I, approximately 40 percent of scholarships go to international players. The top 25 schools in Division II award roughly 70 percent of their scholarships to female players from abroad."

  • Isn't this why the Special Olympics exist?

    There are church leagues and leagues at the Y that serve this purpose. Schools shouldn't be forced to be like them.

    signature image signature image signature image

    Formerly Venomous Green Duck. Join Date: Nov. 2004 # of posts: 17,867.

  • At MSU recently? Field Hockey. And men's swimming, basketball and cross country all have less scholarships to give than the women's coach does at MSU and most other schools. The only exceptions are places like Stanford which had alumni donate enough money to create an endowment for every single athletic scholarship that they offer.

    At places like CMU it's more prevalent. The women's cross country coach recently called random freshman that had played 2 or more sports in high school, offering them scholarships because they couldn't fill them, and they risked having to revoke men's scholarships in other sports.

  • To the people talking about how women's sports messed things up, look no further than Wisconsin baseball...

  • Don't you know this already, VGD23123? Those are religious organiz-aaa-tions and private clubs. These cannot be trusted to be fair. Only gubament can be trusted to be "fair." You know, like affirmative action. Fairness. Equality. Elitism. This is progress. Are you against progress, VGD23123? If so, you may be reported to the Mods, or worse. To gubament officials.

  • Lock the thread . . . . No, lock the entire Board. thumbsup