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Home Improvement Gurus - Deck Advice (Updated w/Pics)

  • Phil McCrackin said...

    Local building codes in Chicago and surrounding suburbs require 42" footings.

    This, and as well they should. It is the recognized IBC standard for this climate zone.

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    FREE YOUR BREASTS! FREE YOUR MIND!

    Archangel

  • If I had to do it all over again I would go with the composite. Within a year the deck looks like hell. I get pine sap all over it and if you power wash it too hard you screw up the grain in the wood. Looking to put a spa outside and when I do the entire thing is going to be ripped up and replaced.

    EdMartinsLoan

  • I had a deck restoration division of the business I owned for 8 years. Best is composite for ease of care. I would never do pressure treated. DO NOT do anything to cedar first year. Use Sherwin products for cleaning and staining. I would recommend a semi-transparent water based stain of your color choice. When pressure washing, practice on a scrap board laid in the driveway or such. Key is to be about 6 inches from wood at a slight angle, using correct spray nozzle attachment.
    Talk to Sherwin guys about all facets. I have personally done about 500 decks myself and usually last about 5 years (in harsh Minnesota) before having to touch again.

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    Living A Spartan Life!

    SPARTASOTAN

  • SPARTASOTAN said...

    I had a deck restoration division of the business I owned for 8 years. Best is composite for ease of care. I would never do pressure treated. DO NOT do anything to cedar first year. Use Sherwin products for cleaning and staining. I would recommend a semi-transparent water based stain of your color choice. When pressure washing, practice on a scrap board laid in the driveway or such. Key is to be about 6 inches from wood at a slight angle, using correct spray nozzle attachment. Talk to Sherwin guys about all facets. I have personally done about 500 decks myself and usually last about 5 years (in harsh Minnesota) before having to touch again.

    As for finishing in the first year this guy says different. What is your logic for not refinishing the first year as I have heard conflicting advice.

    http://www.wrcla.org/pdf/Finishing_WRC_Decks.pdf

    Spartytruth

  • I used a post hole digger for mine, (I only needed 4 posts) it wasn't bad. It was all clay, ran into a couple rocks but still got them done within a couple hours.

    Dig the holes 42" deep, use concrete to fill in the holes, not gravel. Trust me.

    I built mine with pressure treated wood, and used a colored stain. I wouldn't recommend this, I need to touch up the stain every year due to wear and tear and shoveling every winter. I probably should have used composite but I wanted a particular color.

    ROtown Sparty

  • oldgreentar1 said...

    Use the ledger board. I have built more decks then I care to count for friends and have done all of them with a ledger(never had one that leaked). Besides it eliminates one row of post. What is easier, putting in about a few lag bolts(or just tapcons) or digging post holes and filling with conc? If you ever wrestle with a power auger I think you will know the answer. Definitely use conc. not stone or gravel on the rest of post. Now days you don't have to set the post into the conc. Just pour the conc. a couple of inches higher then the surrounding finish grade. Once exact post locations are determined tapcon post holders into the top of footings and insert and nail post into holder. Once beams and joist are set, trim post as needed keeping the perimeter post extended if you intend to use them for your handrail. The rest is simple stuff . Good luck and my bill is in the mail.

    My main concern with the ledger board is it would go into veneer bricks (the ones that arent solid but have 3 holes vertically in yhe center). Anyone know if this would hold or would the brick crumble? The facing of some against our front steps has crumbled and i dont want the ledger ripping out of weak bricks. Thoughts?

    Edit: Also - are those bricks really veneer bricks? I think of veneer as just a thin layer of fake brick but the guy who did our inspection and appraisal called them veneer. These are actual bricks, not just a fake layer...would the center holes be filled with mortar and thus be able to support a ledger?

    This post was edited by Uncle Awesome on 6/2/2011 at 9:20 AM

    Uncle Awesome

  • Go to the lumber yard and get the name of a guy who digs post holes for a living. For about the same cost of renting a post hole digger he'll come out and dig the post holes for you. They usually charge 8-10 bucks per hole, and will be done in about 30 minutes. You and your buddy will spend half a day going to get the machine, screwing around figuring out how to use it, then returning the machine. Sink them to 42 inches, fill with concrete and put brackets in the wet concrete to hold the posts. Don't sink the posts into the concrete.

    vator88

  • Uncle Awesome said...

    My main concern with the ledger board is it would go into veneer bricks (the ones that arent solid but have 3 holes vertically in yhe center). Anyone know if this would hold or would the brick crumble? The facing of some against our front steps has crumbled and i dont want the ledger ripping out of weak bricks. Thoughts?

    Edit: Also - are those bricks really veneer bricks? I think of veneer as just a thin layer of fake brick but the guy who did our inspection and appraisal called them veneer. These are actual bricks, not just a fake layer...would the center holes be filled with mortar and thus be able to support a ledger?

    The brick will crumble, do not use brick as an anchor, you have to go into conrete or thru to the rim joist.

    Also, make sure you are using a hammer drill with a masonry bit to drill the holes. A masonry bit with a regular drill will a) take forever and b) likely destroy the bit and maybe the drill depending on how many holes you drill. A hammer drill and masonry bit will cut right into it almost like drilling into wood.

    This post was edited by vator88 on 6/2/2011 at 10:04 AM

    vator88

  • EdMartin'sLoan said...

    If I had to do it all over again I would go with the composite. Within a year the deck looks like hell. I get pine sap all over it and if you power wash it too hard you screw up the grain in the wood. Looking to put a spa outside and when I do the entire thing is going to be ripped up and replaced.

    My big issue with composite (besides it being about 4 times the cost of PT) is that the color does not last like they claim. I had built a work table for my Grill using composite, colored a medium brown. Within 3 months it weathered grey like any other wood, went to the mfrs website and they claimed hitting it with an oxidyzing cleaner and the color would come back, nope. Turns out any composite with wood as part of its make up will turn grey eventually. I just had the table so it wasn't a huge deal for me, but if I had a whole deck of it expecting it to be the medium brown ('cedar') color that I was sold I'd be pissed. Secondarily, most of these come with some sort of embossed finish that, in my case, attracts alot of dust and dirt and then mold grows on it. so you have to clean it fairly often. That said, I am heading into the 3rd refinishing of my PT deck since 2005, it will cost me about 200 bucks for stripper, cleaner, finish and probably two weekends to complete. I'm tempted to just let it go, wood goes bad over the next 4-6 years and buy new boards and put them down in one day, live with for 10 years, repeat. Redoing these things is a pain in the ass.

    vator88

  • vator88 said...

    The brick will crumble, do not use brick as an anchor, you have to go into conrete or thru to the rim joist.

    Also, make sure you are using a hammer drill with a masonry bit to drill the holes. A masonry bit with a regular drill will a) take forever and b) likely destroy the bit and maybe the drill depending on how many holes you drill. A hammer drill and masonry bit will cut right into it almost like drilling into wood.

    What he said, ideally you want to through bolt the ledger into the house rim board/joist using carriage bolts, not lags, so it can't pull through. Usually if you are stepping out from the first floor this works out, if you have a brick veneer (bricks covering the outside of the house) you will drill through the brick and then into the framing, if your basement ceiling is accessible you may want to drill from the inside out so you miss any stuff that could be in the way. If the ceiling is not accessible, you may be forced to use lags, but don't count on the brick to hold them, get into the rim joist and use a lot of them. Feel free to PM me if I am confusing you.

    "This board would be great if it weren't for all the posters. ." -- AA Spartan 12/16/11

    IB Fine

  • Bump - Forgot to update this last year, but was staining the stairs today and thought about this.

    Finished up last year, with some to do's for this spring (stain stairs, add lattice, etc). Ended up going with:

    16'x29'
    Treated for the joists/ledgers
    Cedar for everything else

    We ended up not attaching to the house with a ledger. I wasn't comfortable doing that so we added in an extra row of supports and there isn't a creak or noise out of it.. The cedar looks awesome. I knew going into it that it would be soft and scratch up a bit, so I have had no issues there. The staining takes a whole afternoon, but I actually kind of enjoy taking care of it after I put so much time into it. I had help getting the holes augured and the joists/beams in. After that I built the rest myself and hand build each section of the railing.

    Had my father in law install a sliding door for easy access too and then we put in a little vegetable garden in front with left over lattice to keep out the rascally rabbits.

    The main issue I had was when I got about 4-5 rows of boards down a storm knocked a neighbors tree right onto the section I had finished. Only had 2 boards break, so I got lucky there.

    As for stain, I used a semi-transparent called ReadySeal. So far no major issues. Went on easy and seems to do its job pretty well. I re-stained today because I had leftover and I had to do the stairs anyway, but probably didn't need to.

    This post was edited by Uncle Awesome on 5/28/2012 at 7:52 PM

    attachmentattachment

    Uncle Awesome

  • spot on for what the others have posted regarding cedar upkeep.... I also use sherwin stains exclusively....

    Went cedar decking.. treated posts and joists

    I kind of enjoy staining it-eazy schmeezy--but maybe thats just me

    next purchase--new AC unit--fudge

    lolo

  • vator88 said...

    Go to the lumber yard and get the name of a guy who digs post holes for a living. For about the same cost of renting a post hole digger he'll come out and dig the post holes for you. They usually charge 8-10 bucks per hole, and will be done in about 30 minutes. You and your buddy will spend half a day going to get the machine, screwing around figuring out how to use it, then returning the machine. Sink them to 42 inches, fill with concrete and put brackets in the wet concrete to hold the posts. Don't sink the posts into the concrete.

    We rented the auger and it was the best money spent. We had 15 holes to dig. Got to use the auger for 11 of them and had to dig 4 by hand due to gas line concerns (then 2 more later when doing the steps). They really need to invent a better post hole digger. Once you get to about 36 inches, you cant get anything out. I ended up chopping the dirt up with the diggers and using a shop vac to get the dirt out. Was way quicker that way.

    We got really lucky with the auger though. The guys marked the gas line for us, but they were off by over a foot. We pulled the auger out and realized we ran right up against it, but no damage.

    Uncle Awesome

  • Uncle Awesome said...

    Bump - Forgot to update this last year, but was staining the stairs today and thought about this.

    Finished up last year, with some to do's for this spring (stain stairs, add lattice, etc). Ended up going with:

    16'x29' Treated for the joists/ledgers Cedar for everything else

    We ended up not attaching to the house with a ledger. I wasn't comfortable doing that so we added in an extra row of supports and there isn't a creak or noise out of it.. The cedar looks awesome. I knew going into it that it would be soft and scratch up a bit, so I have had no issues there. The staining takes a whole afternoon, but I actually kind of enjoy taking care of it after I put so much time into it. I had help getting the holes augured and the joists/beams in. After that I built the rest myself and hand build each section of the railing.

    Had my father in law install a sliding door for easy access too and then we put in a little vegetable garden in front with left over lattice to keep out the rascally rabbits.

    The main issue I had was when I got about 4-5 rows of boards down a storm knocked a neighbors tree right onto the section I had finished. Only had 2 boards break, so I got lucky there.

    As for stain, I used a semi-transparent called ReadySeal. So far no major issues. Went on easy and seems to do its job pretty well. I re-stained today because I had leftover and I had to do the stairs anyway, but probably didn't need to.

    Looks awesome, but I'd pull that lattice off in a year or two...cheapens the look and doesn't age well. Other than that looks great, have fun maintaining the cedar...it's worth it!

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    Sparts

  • Use the brackets where you screw the planks from the bottom and pull them to the frame

    GRR Spartan

  • Sparts said...

    Looks awesome, but I'd pull that lattice off in a year or two...cheapens the look and doesn't age well. Other than that looks great, have fun maintaining the cedar...it's worth it!

    its cedar lattice as well - I just havent gotten around to staining it yet. Once I do, I am hoping it blends in better.

    We have a lot of rabbits, raccoons, etc in our neighborhood so using it to keep them out. Seems to be working so far.

    Uncle Awesome