Online Now 2514

MSU Red Cedar Message Board

The largest and most active MSU Spartans board on the web

On this Board 1760
Record: 12118 (3/18/2012)

Online now 2277
Record: 10351 (3/11/2012)

Boards ▾

MSU Red Cedar Message Board

The largest and most active MSU Spartans board on the web

The Press Box

The place to ask questions to SpartanTailgate's recruiting experts

Duffy Daugherty Forum

"The Duff" is dedicated to Michigan State football recruiting discussion

Jack Breslin Forum

"The Bres" is dedicated to Michigan State basketball recruiting discussion

Wells Hall Off Topic Board

This is your pulpit to preach to the masses about everything from politics to religion

Marketplace & Ticket Exchange

The place to buy, trade or sell Michigan State tickets

Fantasy Sports Forum

For fantasy football and other fantasy sports discussion

Test/Feedback Forum

Reply

Post-2011 season verdict on Roushar and Samuel

  • What do you guys think?

    I think Samuel was a good hire. Hopefully the recruiting connections in Texas will pay off soon, and Kerrick was directly quoted as saying Samuel was one of the reasons he picked us. Samuel was also co-recruiter on Burbridge and Madaris.

    From a coaching standpoint, I think he did a great job. BJ was more consistent than ever, but most importantly, Keshawn developed into a true WR. Huge, marked improvement from going just from our jack-of-all-trades athlete to a consistent WR threat to complement BJ.

    Roushar as a recruiter has been, well, bad. He got us Jack Allen in 2011, nobody in 2012 or 2013 so far. That said, as an OL/TE coach he did a decent job. As an OC, he had some awful games (ND, Nebraska) and some awful moments (early UGA). However, he did call some excellent games (Michigan, Wisconsin, Iowa, B1GCCG, and the latter half of the Outback bowl).

    You could also throw Staten in there. His first year coaching the OL, did a pretty decent job considering the injuries and inexperience we dealt with.

    So on a standard A to F grade rating, what would you grade the 1) Recruiting and 2) Coaching of these three new positional coaches?

    Macks

  • Macks said...

    What do you guys think?

    I think Samuel was a good hire. Hopefully the recruiting connections in Texas will pay off soon, and Kerrick was directly quoted as saying Samuel was one of the reasons he picked us. Samuel was also co-recruiter on Burbridge and Madaris.

    From a coaching standpoint, I think he did a great job. BJ was more consistent than ever, but most importantly, Keshawn developed into a true WR. Huge, marked improvement from going just from our jack-of-all-trades athlete to a consistent WR threat to complement BJ.

    Roushar as a recruiter has been, well, bad. He got us Jack Allen in 2011, nobody in 2012 or 2013 so far. That said, as an OL/TE coach he did a decent job. As an OC, he had some awful games (ND, Nebraska) and some awful moments (early UGA). However, he did call some excellent games (Michigan, Wisconsin, Iowa, B1GCCG, and the latter half of the Outback bowl).

    You could also throw Staten in there. His first year coaching the OL, did a pretty decent job considering the injuries and inexperience we dealt with.

    So on a standard A to F grade rating, what would you grade the 1) Recruiting and 2) Coaching of these three new positional coaches?

    staten and samuel are two of best position coaches we've had in recent memory IMO. As thus far coaching-wise (although coach D has preached about complacency) staten gets bonus points for being an effing beast on the sidelines, that dude is just imposing.

    recruiting-wise, the talent we've brought in with these two is, once again, some of the best we've had in recent memory. even when u control for program success, give these two big time credit. B+

    for me, roushar was just too damn inconsistent. i realize that offensive plans will change game to game (obviously), but games like nebraska worry me. when half of tRCMB is screaming at the TV for every rush, rush, pass, punt drive, something has gotta change earlier than he did. i firmly believe the knowledge is there, as evidenced by all the offensive success we've had. but sometimes it seems like he is too stubborn and afraid to improvise some. so for him an incomplete.

    i wont pretend to know about his recruiting so far. but thats my twocents

    603spartan

  • After watching Narduzzi's defense in 2009, I keep telling myself that I gotta give the guy time before I make up my mind. But goddamn if the first play in the Outback Bowl wasn't the dumbest play call I've ever seen.

    signature image

    ashamanAJSV ●

  • ashamanAJSV said...

    After watching Narduzzi's defense in 2009, I keep telling myself that I gotta give the guy time before I make up my mind. But goddamn if the first play in the Outback Bowl wasn't the dumbest play call I've ever seen.

    See that remains a point of contention. It wasn't a great idea against a defense of Georgia's caliber, but at the same time, if it had worked we would have been talking about what a great call it was to go all-or-nothing on the first play to put the Bulldogs on their heels.

    It wasn't as bad a call as people think. If Keshawn makes one man miss, he's gone. TD.
    As it was, Boykin sniffed it out and made an excellent play (one of many others he made in that game) which put us in a sour situation early.

    Macks

  • ashamanAJSV said...

    After watching Narduzzi's defense in 2009, I keep telling myself that I gotta give the guy time before I make up my mind. But goddamn if the first play in the Outback Bowl wasn't the dumbest play call I've ever seen.

    Did you see the fake FG vs. ND?

    Edit: this year, not little giants

    This post was edited by MSUManiac13 on 5/4/2012 at 12:05 AM

    MSUManiac13 ●

  • MSUManiac13 said...

    Did you see the fake FG vs. ND?

    That was a supposedly Dantonio-made call.

    Macks

  • Roushar needs to create an offensive identity. Narduzzi created one after awhile, so I understand that it takes time. Last year I always felt the offense ran through series at times without much flow, part of which could have been dealing with some young oline. Both Wisconsin games, especially the title game, were called very good. The Nebraska game was horrendous.

    El Doctor B

  • Macks said...

    See that remains a point of contention. It wasn't a great idea against a defense of Georgia's caliber, but at the same time, if it had worked we would have been talking about what a great call it was to go all-or-nothing on the first play to put the Bulldogs on their heels.

    It wasn't as bad a call as people think. If Keshawn makes one man miss, he's gone. TD. As it was, Boykin sniffed it out and made an excellent play (one of many others he made in that game) which put us in a sour situation early.

    The Steelers had a pretty similar play against the Jets two seasons ago, in which it was something like 3rd and 7 on their own 4 yard line. Lined up in the shotgun, delayed draw to Mendenhall, tackled in the end zone the same time as the handoff. The city obviously wanted Bruce Arians' head after that one, but the story started circling (much like yours) that if that one guard had held his block a little locker, Mendenhall might've gained 20 yards. The team has since declined to renew Arians' contract.

    IMO, it doesn't matter how much you COULD have gained if something had gone a little differently; you just can't let a RB or WR stand in the end zone for multiple seconds waiting for the ball. The risk-reward just isn't worth it.

    FWIW, here's the video of the safety. It's debatable how much Martin could have gained (I'm thinking 1-3 yards), but there were multiple defenders in place to prevent a TD.

    Play

    Brandon Boykin saftey vs. Michigan State -...

    Georgia CB Brandon Boykin makes the tackle for a saftey in the Outback Bowl

    http://www.youtube.com/v/z48P_m2jo9c
    signature image

    ashamanAJSV ●

  • Salem has made the staff better, because he's a better RB coach than Enos. No disrespect to Enos, but he was out of position as just a RB coach (though his recruiting is still paying off).

    Samuel seems to have been the right choice, but he'll be much more important this year with the experience WRs, while last year the WRs didn't need as much coaching up.

    Roushar with a new QB, and an adapted offense for him, could do really well. Or he could suck. I'm thinking he does well.

    Batesianmimicry ●

  • ashamanAJSV said...

    The Steelers had a pretty similar play against the Jets two seasons ago, in which it was something like 3rd and 7 on their own 4 yard line. Lined up in the shotgun, delayed draw to Mendenhall, tackled in the end zone the same time as the handoff. The city obviously wanted Bruce Arians' head after that one, but the story started circling (much like yours) that if that one guard had held his block a little locker, Mendenhall might've gained 20 yards. The team has since declined to renew Arians' contract.

    IMO, it doesn't matter how much you COULD have gained if something had gone a little differently; you just can't let a RB or WR stand in the end zone for multiple seconds waiting for the ball. The risk-reward just isn't worth it.

    FWIW, here's the video of the safety. It's debatable how much Martin could have gained (I'm thinking 1-3 yards), but there were multiple defenders in place to prevent a TD.

    Thank you!

    Hopefully Macks and Punisher99 stop with all of the shoulda wouldas now. It was an absolutely terrible call.

    Jor El

  • Macks said...

    What do you guys think?

    I think Samuel was a good hire. Hopefully the recruiting connections in Texas will pay off soon, and Kerrick was directly quoted as saying Samuel was one of the reasons he picked us. Samuel was also co-recruiter on Burbridge and Madaris.

    From a coaching standpoint, I think he did a great job. BJ was more consistent than ever, but most importantly, Keshawn developed into a true WR. Huge, marked improvement from going just from our jack-of-all-trades athlete to a consistent WR threat to complement BJ.

    Roushar as a recruiter has been, well, bad. He got us Jack Allen in 2011, nobody in 2012 or 2013 so far. That said, as an OL/TE coach he did a decent job. As an OC, he had some awful games (ND, Nebraska) and some awful moments (early UGA). However, he did call some excellent games (Michigan, Wisconsin, Iowa, B1GCCG, and the latter half of the Outback bowl).

    You could also throw Staten in there. His first year coaching the OL, did a pretty decent job considering the injuries and inexperience we dealt with.

    So on a standard A to F grade rating, what would you grade the 1) Recruiting and 2) Coaching of these three new positional coaches?

    Samuel will be put to the test this year. I honestly can't say how much of an effect he had on Cunningham and Martin; both produced well, but that could have also been a by-product of having the same QB for the 3rd straight year, plus Martin being healthy. Remember, Martin was hurt in 2010 and paved the way for Fowler to get some PT that season.

    Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.

    SpartanRocky ●

  • ashamanAJSV said...

    After watching Narduzzi's defense in 2009, I keep telling myself that I gotta give the guy time before I make up my mind. But goddamn if the first play in the Outback Bowl wasn't the dumbest play call I've ever seen.

    At the same time, I felt the CCG was probably the best offensively-called game of the MD era. Iowa was a well-called game as well as UM and tOSU.

    MSU should have scored 20-23 points vs. tOSU based on play-calling. The UM game was very smart; short passes to avoid risks with the wind, and a power-run game.

    That's mixed in with the ND and Nebraska WTF games. I felt the D played quite well in both, but they needed SOMETHING from the O. The bigger issue on that fake FG was the KR TD given up earlier in the half; if ND doesn't get it, then MSU definitely kicks a chip-shot to get to 13-14 going into halftime.

    Second half of the Bowl game was very encouraging, because it showed some very real adjustments could be made by Roushar at halftime. Linthicum had his only 100 yard receiving game of his career that day.

    Really, the first year coaches get an incomplete. This year we'll see what they can do with some inexperienced players . . . but who are in the 2nd year of the new O system.

    Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.

    SpartanRocky ●

  • MSUManiac13 said...

    Did you see the fake FG vs. ND?

    Edit: this year, not little giants

    That was all Dantonio. One of the few mistakes he has made. Everyone knew that was coming.

    Posting member of tRCMB since 1997. It is ALWAYS a great day to be a Spartan!!!!

    Raytooth Morgan

  • SpartanRocky said...

    At the same time, I felt the CCG was probably the best offensively-called game of the MD era. Iowa was a well-called game as well as UM and tOSU.

    MSU should have scored 20-23 points vs. tOSU based on play-calling. The UM game was very smart; short passes to avoid risks with the wind, and a power-run game.

    That's mixed in with the ND and Nebraska WTF games. I felt the D played quite well in both, but they needed SOMETHING from the O. The bigger issue on that fake FG was the KR TD given up earlier in the half; if ND doesn't get it, then MSU definitely kicks a chip-shot to get to 13-14 going into halftime.

    Second half of the Bowl game was very encouraging, because it showed some very real adjustments could be made by Roushar at halftime. Linthicum had his only 100 yard receiving game of his career that day.

    Really, the first year coaches get an incomplete. This year we'll see what they can do with some inexperienced players . . . but who are in the 2nd year of the new O system.

    I'd agree with just about everything you said. I wasn't at all suggesting that one play in a bowl game makes him a bad O coordinator, only that like Suton against Gonzaga, it'll take a while before I'll be able to get that play out of my mind.

    Overall, it was a mixed bag in his first year directing the offense. After all the criticism I threw at Narduzzi a few years ago, though, I don't mind giving Roushar a few years to prove himself, and there were certainly plenty of flashes of potential. We'll see how it goes. coachd

    signature image

    ashamanAJSV ●

  • ashamanAJSV said...

    I'd agree with just about everything you said. I wasn't at all suggesting that one play in a bowl game makes him a bad O coordinator, only that like Suton against Gonzaga, it'll take a while before I'll be able to get that play out of my mind.

    Overall, it was a mixed bag in his first year directing the offense. After all the criticism I threw at Narduzzi a few years ago, though, I don't mind giving Roushar a few years to prove himself, and there were certainly plenty of flashes of potential. We'll see how it goes. coachd

    I also think that, given the horrible shape of the OL (Barrent and Klatt, the LT/C projected starters, both get injured in the spring, Barrent's is career ending, then Klatt's replacement, Treadwell, and the starting RT, Burkland, go out in the 3rd game of the year, MSU is stuck with essentially 2nd string OTs and a 3rd string C for the bulk of the season), Roushar did well. He actually put up more points and YPG in '11 than Treadwell did in '10.

    Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.

    SpartanRocky ●

Michigan State
247Sports
Features
Resources
Connect

247Sports In partnership with CBS Sports