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The Dark Knight Rises - Discussion Thread (SPOILERS)

  • Good movie. One thing that drove me nuts was during the stock market/motor cycle chase scene.

    When they left the stock market, it was bright and sunny out, which makes sense seeing as the market closes at 4. What couldn't have been more then a few minutes later though, it was pitch black out. The only way that is maybe possible is if it happened to be the shortest day of the year, and they walked into the market at 3:59. And that the chase was happening around 4:45-5:15 ish. Of course, that one dude was ordering lunch, which wouldn't make a whole lot of sense if it was the very end of the day.

    TravisotCosmos

  • Death Roe said...

    I think part of it was making the citizens of Gotham suffer for a while before the bomb went off. Kind of like taunting them, giving them false hope that one of the actual citizens HAS the detonator.

    Ra's' original plan, mind you, was the fear toxin over-time rotting Gotham entirely, making the citizens tear each other apart. They obviously can't get the fear toxin anymore, so this was the next method.

    Also, Bane discusses that death with hope is worse than death. The hope that some life trumps no life.

    signature image

    RBW Spartan

  • fhionnlaigh said...

    The device was originally designed as a reactor. The way I was picturing it is that the core has some sort of control mechanism, similar to the control rods used in reactor cores in nuclear power plants. It's possible that the conversion to weapon may have involved altering a failsafe trigger of sorts to, instead of fully inserting control rods into the core and slowing a neutron cascade below self-sustaining levels or even to a stop, remove the rods completely. A design like that would effectively allow instantaneous neutron cascades within the core (assuming that this technology is based on a nuclear concept, which I don't recall), and an uncontrolled neutron cascade == meltdown, destabilization, and basically going nuclear.

    nerdnerdnerdnerdnerdnerdnerdnerdnerdnerdnerdnerdnerdnerdnerd

    signature image

    RBW Spartan

  • fhionnlaigh said...

    The device was originally designed as a reactor. The way I was picturing it is that the core has some sort of control mechanism, similar to the control rods used in reactor cores in nuclear power plants. It's possible that the conversion to weapon may have involved altering a failsafe trigger of sorts to, instead of fully inserting control rods into the core and slowing a neutron cascade below self-sustaining levels or even to a stop, remove the rods completely. A design like that would effectively allow instantaneous neutron cascades within the core (assuming that this technology is based on a nuclear concept, which I don't recall), and an uncontrolled neutron cascade == meltdown, destabilization, and basically going nuclear.

    I think we're both wrong or don't know enough because it's fusion and I know much, much less about fusion reactors than fission reactors. I'm not sure they use control rods like I said, it doesn't rely on neutrons at all to control the rates. Supposedly it relies on confinement of the super-heated plasma to control the rate of fusion, and I honestly can say I don't know much about that process. Perhaps you do! Even if I, or you, did, it's probably semantics anyway!

    sprtnjdk

  • sprtnjdk said...

    I think we're both wrong or don't know enough because it's fusion and I know much, much less about fusion reactors than fission reactors. I'm not sure they use control rods like I said, it doesn't rely on neutrons at all to control the rates. Supposedly it relies on confinement of the super-heated plasma to control the rate of fusion, and I honestly can say I don't know much about that process. Perhaps you do! Even if I, or you, did, it's probably semantics anyway!

    You're right, I had forgotten that detail from the movie (went to the midnight show and I will admit with no shame that it was well past my bedtime!). You and I are in the same boat; I know a lot less about fusion reactors than fission reactors. I'll have to look up some more info on that, but either fusion is self-controlling once started (like stellar fusion) until some sort of transition is reached, or there has to be some sort of controlling mechanism, be it a control rod or something else (not sure). What I mean by "transition" is that the material being fused is exhausted, and if conditions allow, a heavier material will be fused (and this is harder to do). If conditions don't allow, fusion eventually shuts down. With very large stars, you get destabilization and runaway contraction of the star until it goes nova/supernova. Without whatever sort of controls a reactor would need to maintain long-term fusion, it could be weaponized. Assuming it's trying to replicate stellar fusion conditions found in a very large star on a tiny scale, it does make sense that the core would be fine for some finite period of time before that "transition" occurs and blows the whole things apart.

    This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by fhionnlaigh on 7/21/2012 at 7:11 PM

    SMB; MC-ICP-MS

    fhionnlaigh

  • fhionnlaigh said...

    You're right, I had forgotten that detail from the movie (went to the midnight show and I will admit with no shame that it was well past my bedtime!). You and I are in the same boat; I know a lot less about fusion reactors than fission reactors. I'll have to look up some more info on that, but either fusion is self-controlling once started (like stellar fusion) until some sort of transition is reached, or there has to be some sort of controlling mechanism, be it a control rod or something else (not sure). What I mean by "transition" is that the material being fused is exhausted, and if conditions allow, a heavier material will be fused (and this is harder to do). If conditions don't allow, fusion eventually shuts down. With very large stars, you get destabilization and runaway contraction of the star until it goes nova/supernova. Without whatever sort of controls a reactor would need to maintain long-term fusion, it could be weaponized. Assuming it's trying to replicate stellar fusion conditions found in a very large star on a tiny scale, it does make sense that the core would be fine for some finite period of time before that "transition" occurs and blows the whole things apart.

    Bingo.

    This post was edited by sprtnjdk on 7/21/2012 at 7:17 PM

    sprtnjdk

  • sprtnjdk said...

    I think we're both wrong or don't know enough because it's fusion and I know much, much less about fusion reactors than fission reactors. I'm not sure they use control rods like I said, it doesn't rely on neutrons at all to control the rates. Supposedly it relies on confinement of the super-heated plasma to control the rate of fusion, and I honestly can say I don't know much about that process. Perhaps you do! Even if I, or you, did, it's probably semantics anyway!

    That's mostly because Fusion reactors don't exist.

    signature image

    RBW Spartan

  • RBW Spartan said...

    That's mostly because Fusion reactors don't exist.

    Oh really?

    http://discovermagazine.com/2010/extreme-universe/18-do-it-yourself-basement-fusion/

    Also don't look up during the day. Glaring evidence they do.

    This post was edited by sprtnjdk on 7/21/2012 at 7:32 PM

    sprtnjdk

  • sprtnjdk said...

    Oh really?

    http://discovermagazine.com/2010/extreme-universe/18-do-it-yourself-basement-fusion/

    Also don't look up during the day. Glaring evidence they do.

    I'm sorry. I meant human made that could be reasonable power sources (i.e. to power Gotham).

    signature image

    RBW Spartan

  • RBW Spartan said...

    I'm sorry. I meant human made that could be reasonable power sources (i.e. to power Gotham).

    Nor could we find the Higgs Boson.

    sprtnjdk

  • Went to a matinee today to see the movie. I thought it was very well done, I wasn't sure what to expect, I didn't read teh comics so the whole Az Ghoul story line is a little confusing to me at times. I'm glad I didn't know much going into it, although I can kind of see where they may have changed the storyline after Ledger died, that whole scenario was rife for a Joker character to be part of.

    Bane was, at times, difficult to understand but overall I liked the character. I thought the story was great and it was an ok ending. I only say that because I thought I had read that the ending was going to be definite and it left a lot open, especially with a franchise like this I'm not hoping they continue the story.

    It didn't feel like 2:45, I thought it moved right along.

    General rant - Something needs to change in the superhero storyline. They need to get away from Superhero and Supervillian meet up for a fight. Supervillian wins and almost kills Superhero. Superhero uses P90X for 6 months and comes back to kicks Supervillian ass. Maybe that is what makes the Joker such an awesome villian, he just wants to play, he doesn't want to kill his adversary. I should probably watch Dark Knight again before saying that. Regardless, I hope something will come along soon and maybe change things up a little, maybe it will take multiple supervillians.

    I also kind of wish that Scarecrow would have done a little more, although I do like that they keep him in all the movies.

    I was completely fooled by Talia, although I was wondering why they went the route of Bruce sleeping with her instead of Catwoman.

    signature image signature image signature image

    Now knowing what 1995 is like all over again! Thank you 247 technology!!

    InTenSity

  • InTenSity said...

    that whole scenario was rife for a Joker character to be part of.

    Great point that I never really thought of. With all that chaos going on, there would have been great opportunities for the Joker character. Would have taken a really long movie, though, to wrap everything up.

    Francis Whitman

  • Francis Whitman said...

    Great point that I never really thought of. With all that chaos going on, there would have been great opportunities for the Joker character. Would have taken a really long movie, though, to wrap everything up.

    Joker could have been one of the men freed from the Prison, then you can have Robin start to mess with him in a game of cat and mouse instead of so much focus on which of the 3 moving trucks had the fusion device. I'm not sure, but I could just imagine the Joker running through that city, maybe even fighting some with Bane.

    signature image signature image signature image

    Now knowing what 1995 is like all over again! Thank you 247 technology!!

    InTenSity

  • I will upvote everything anyone posts for a week if they watch my kid on Sunday so tWife and myself can go see this.

    Izzo Court

  • Izzo Court said...

    I will upvote everything anyone posts for a week if they watch my kid on Sunday so tWife and myself can go see this.

    Don't ask Forbin.

    sprtnjdk

  • RBW Spartan said...

    That's mostly because Fusion reactors don't exist.

    Neither does Batman rumor

    signature image signature image signature image

    Braintrust

  • InTenSity said...

    Joker could have been one of the men freed from the Prison, then you can have Robin start to mess with him in a game of cat and mouse instead of so much focus on which of the 3 moving trucks had the fusion device. I'm not sure, but I could just imagine the Joker running through that city, maybe even fighting some with Bane.

    Yeah, that would have been cool. It's also cool, though, how each film is a distinct chapter. Can't imagine these ever being topped in this genre.

    Francis Whitman

  • Francis Whitman said...

    Great point that I never really thought of. With all that chaos going on, there would have been great opportunities for the Joker character. Would have taken a really long movie, though, to wrap everything up.

    The story that much of the movie was based on, No Man's Land, heavily features Joker.

    Anyone. Anyplace. Anytime.

    rookmsu

  • Yeah... there was no ambiguous ending. Bruce Wayne patched the software to enable the autopilot, so he probably jumped off somewhere around/near Gotham and let the plane explode with the bomb.

    Alfred saw Bruce Wayne and Selina in Europe, and it was real (not a dream or a vision or anything).

    arfabe16

  • rookmsu said...

    The story that much of the movie was based on, No Man's Land, heavily features Joker.

    I do like that they went with Bane. It is not a character I knew before the movie and I think it was somewhat of a gamble, even if it did follow the Knighftall storyline, he is not a character many people who don't read the comics know and it was believable and pulled off well. I'm still not sure what the mask is though, whether it is a breathing device or a way to keep his head together after all the other prisoners might have ripped it off. It was a believable character, although I kind of thought at the end they might have wrecked him. Throughout the movie he came off as a genious supervillian who is stronger and faster than anyone else. I thought the last scene before he dies(?) made it come off as though he was taking orders and a mindless thug the whole time.

    signature image signature image signature image

    Now knowing what 1995 is like all over again! Thank you 247 technology!!

    InTenSity

  • rookmsu said...

    The story that much of the movie was based on, No Man's Land, heavily features Joker.

    I'll have to check some of those out, they sound cool. Any suggestions where to start?

    Francis Whitman

  • Francis Whitman said...

    I'll have to check some of those out, they sound cool. Any suggestions where to start?

    Sounds like you've read Knightfall. No Man's Land is great. Legacy is essentially a rematch with Bane and Ra's Al Ghul. Those are some of the better collected graphic novels. The Vengeance of Bane one-shot, if you can find it, is awesome too. Killing Joke is the ultimate Joker story. The Long Halloween and Year one largely inspired Batman Begins.

    Anyone. Anyplace. Anytime.

    rookmsu

  • InTenSity said...

    Joker could have been one of the men freed from the Prison, then you can have Robin start to mess with him in a game of cat and mouse instead of so much focus on which of the 3 moving trucks had the fusion device. I'm not sure, but I could just imagine the Joker running through that city, maybe even fighting some with Bane.

    The Joker was in Arkham Asylum.

    Blackgate Prison was where all the Dent Act prisoners were kept.

    Do you respect wood?

    Death Roe

  • Maybe I missed it but how does John Blake (JGL character) know that Bruce Wayne is Batman? I know he talked about seeing Bruce at the orphanage but is that it? Do orphans have some special power between them like twins?

    KamState

  • rookmsu said...

    Sounds like you've read Knightfall. No Man's Land is great. Legacy is essentially a rematch with Bane and Ra's Al Ghul. Those are some of the better collected graphic novels. The Vengeance of Bane one-shot, if you can find it, is awesome too. Killing Joke is the ultimate Joker story. The Long Halloween and Year one largely inspired Batman Begins.

    Gracias.

    Francis Whitman