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tOfficial Red Wings offseason thread

  • SpartanInNH said...

    He was taken off the PK when he hurt his ankle -- had to turn his ankle and expose it to more shots to play in the lanes. Babcock thus took him off the PK.

    I know, I know, fire Babcock.

    are you just an ass on hockey threads or are you a full time ass?

    Did you buy your official Red Wings 2011-2012 Record Home Winning Streak-1 playoff win Tee shirt and hat set?

    The Red Wings are old. Too many old guys. They need to keep Bertuzzi as the designated fighter when the other teams put their 6'4" 240 lb fighters on the ice.

    GRR Spartan

  • Bullwrinkle said...

    Wrong. He was still the best D-man on the team. He was a +21 and would have led all D-men on the team in scoring if he hadn't hurt his ankle. The Wings will be thrilled to pay him $6 mil to come back. Every other team in the league would take him for that. They are paying Ericsson over $3 million to score 1 goal. Lidstrom is worth 10 of him.

    Whether he led the team or not in points is irrelevant. You don't pay a guy a wage for his relative worth compared to his other teammates. You compare him to the whole league. And let's face it, Lidstrom did not earn his money this year. Just look at how he ranked among defensemen around the league.

    30th in points
    12th in goals
    T-32nd in assists
    T-7 in Plus/Minus

    That's NOT $6M worth of performance. For the money, Ian White with 7 goals, 25 assists, 32 points and a +23 was MUCH more valuable to the Wings than Lidstrom this year making only $2.9M

    wingfanjim

  • I would give up a lot to get Kopitar that dude is my kind of player

    signature image

    Eggy

  • wingfanjim said...

    Whether he led the team or not in points is irrelevant. You don't pay a guy a wage for his relative worth compared to his other teammates. You compare him to the whole league. And let's face it, Lidstrom did not earn his money this year. Just look at how he ranked among defensemen around the league.

    30th in points 12th in goals T-32nd in assists T-7 in Plus/Minus

    That's NOT $6M worth of performance. For the money, Ian White with 7 goals, 25 assists, 32 points and a +23 was MUCH more valuable to the Wings than Lidstrom this year making only $2.9M

    I don't put too much stock in his total stats. He missed a lot of games.

    In a lot of ways , notably his plus/minus, he was playing better than last season prior to his injury.

    Anyone. Anyplace. Anytime.

    rookmsu

  • Eggy said...

    I would give up a lot to get Kopitar that dude is my kind of player

    package Franzen, Hudler, Cleary and cash or picks for him

    TPain151807

  • T-Pain said...

    package Franzen, Hudler, Cleary and cash or picks for him

    No team in the league will take on Franzen's contract. Hudler isn't under contract and can't be traded unless he's signed.

    Franzen isn't going anywhere.

    This post was edited by rookmsu on 4/22/2012 at 9:16 PM

    Anyone. Anyplace. Anytime.

    rookmsu

  • rookmsu said...

    No team in the league will take on Franzen's contract. Hudler isn't under contract and can't be traded unless he's signed.

    Franzen isn't going anywhere.

    His contract isn't THAT bad

    TPain151807

  • rookmsu said...

    No team in the league will take on Franzen's contract.

    Franzen isn't going anywhere.

    Just wait until I get my next team.

    Signed,

    attachment

    Tek Jansen

  • T-Pain said...

    His contract isn't THAT bad

    Yeah, it is.

    He was signed to be an elite power forward. He's an inconsistent goal scorer with a long history of injury. Unless he transforms into pre-injury Cam Neely overnight, his contract is terrible.

    No one will take it.

    Anyone. Anyplace. Anytime.

    rookmsu

  • rookmsu said...

    I don't put too much stock in his total stats. He missed a lot of games.

    In a lot of ways , notably his plus/minus, he was playing better than last season prior to his injury.

    He missed 12 games. He would have had to average over 3 points a game over those 12 games to match his point totals from last year. The ankle injury is just a cop out. He was having an off year offensively with or without the injury.

    wingfanjim

  • I think there is teams that would take Franzen it is just a matter of what we can get for him. His contract is long, but not that pricy and everyone wants a power forward especially one that can get 30 goals a year.

    signature image

    Eggy

  • wingfanjim said...

    He missed 12 games. He would have had to average over 3 points a game over those 12 games to match his point totals from last year. The ankle injury is just a cop out. He was having an off year offensively with or without the injury.

    Not in terms of plus/minus or his overall play in his own end of the ice. He was playing very well there.

    Anyone. Anyplace. Anytime.

    rookmsu

  • Eggy said...

    I think there is teams that would take Franzen it is just a matter of what we can get for him. His contract is long, but not that pricy and everyone wants a power forward especially one that can get 30 goals a year.

    He's not really a power forward. He scores primarily from the slot and is losing the ability to win the physical battles quickly.

    He has a cap hit of over $5 million for the next four years, and is banged up.

    Good luck finding a taker.

    Anyone. Anyplace. Anytime.

    rookmsu

  • rookmsu said...

    He's not really a power forward. He scores primarily from the slot and is losing the ability to win the physical battles quickly.

    He has a cap hit of over $5 million for the next four years, and is banged up.

    Good luck finding a taker.

    I think Toronto, Florida and Winnipeg would all offer for him.

    signature image

    Eggy

  • Basically, the deal is this. The Wings have about $20M in cap space. With that money they have to fill 4 frontline spots and 2 spots at the blue line. You can fill that space either by re-signing departing free agents, signing new free agents, or promoting from within. How would you do it?

    wingfanjim

  • rookmsu said...

    Not in terms of plus/minus or his overall play in his own end of the ice. He was playing very well there.

    Since when is playing in your own end of the ice an offensive "stat". I said he was having an off year offensively and his numbers back that up. Sure, he had a good year defensively, but defensemen who have good defensive years but mediocre offensive years don't make $6M. They just don't. There is no justifying it.

    wingfanjim

  • Bottom line

    The Wings need to sign Parise, Suter AND trade for Rick Nash

    TPain151807

  • T-Pain said...

    Bottom line

    The Wings need to sign Parise, Suter AND trade for Rick Nash

    Well, they're competing with 15 other teams for Parise and Suter. And Nash doesn't want to play here, as was established at the trade deadline.

    That's going to be a very difficult bottom line to meet.

    Anyone. Anyplace. Anytime.

    rookmsu

  • wingfanjim said...

    Basically, the deal is this. The Wings have about $20M in cap space. With that money they have to fill 4 frontline spots and 2 spots at the blue line. You can fill that space either by re-signing departing free agents, signing new free agents, or promoting from within. How would you do it?

    $20M in cap space

    Parise made $6M in '11-'12 so he's probably going to be a $7.5M-$8.5M player and that's 40% of the cap space for 1 player with 5 players left to sign.

    Suter made $3.5M and Nashville's total payroll was $54M (Wings were 11th at $62.4M) so he's going to be a $5.5M-$6.5M defensemen.

    2011-12 NHL Salaries by Team - USATODAY.com

    2011-12 NHL Salaries by Team - USATODAY.com

    content.usatoday.com

    GRR Spartan

  • T-Pain said...

    Bottom line

    The Wings need to sign Parise, Suter AND trade for Rick Nash

    Parise is likely to get at least $8M, Suter at least another $6M and Nash makes $7.5M. That puts the Wings WAY over the cap with a lot of roster spots to fill.

    wingfanjim

  • GRR Spartan said...

    $20M in cap space

    Parise made $6M in '11-'12 so he's probably going to be a $7.5M-$8.5M player and that's 40% of the cap space for 1 player with 5 players left to sign.

    Suter made $3.5M and Nashville's total payroll was $54M (Wings were 11th at $62.4M) so he's going to be a $5.5M-$6.5M defensemen.

    So that gives you anywhere from $5M to $7M to sign 4 more players. That's not enough to keep Lidstrom at anywhere near his current salary. So either Lidstrom takes a cut to help the team sign the players it needs to compete or they over pay him and the wings sneak into the playoffs (hopefully) and get another 1st or 2nd round exit because you can't polish this old turd of a roster any longer.

    wingfanjim

  • wingfanjim said...

    Parise is likely to get at least $8M, Suter at least another $6M and Nash makes $7.5M. That puts the Wings WAY over the cap with a lot of roster spots to fill.

    Holland will find a way to make it work

    He's good at that

    TPain151807

  • wingfanjim said...

    So that gives you anywhere from $5M to $7M to sign 4 more players. That's not enough to keep Lidstrom at anywhere near his current salary. So either Lidstrom takes a cut to help the team sign the players it needs to compete or they over pay him and the wings sneak into the playoffs (hopefully) and get another 1st or 2nd round exit because you can't polish this old turd of a roster any longer.

    Turd is a bit harsh but what this season showed us is older players take longer to heal and even midseason injuries to older players affect into the playoffs.

    I don't think Illitch will cut Lidstom's salary by 50% so unless Lidstrom decides to hang it up the rebuilding won't be as dramatic as some might hope.

    GRR Spartan

  • T-Pain said...

    Holland will find a way to make it work

    He's good at that

    I don't see why you would do it. For all the bitching about Franzen and his contract, his production is on par with Nash's for half the money.

    Nash put up 30 goals, 29 assists, and 59 points this year making $7.8M
    Franzen had 29 goals, 27 assists, and 56 points this year making only $3.9M

    The BIG difference, Nash was a -19 and Franzen was +23. That's also one more than Nick Lidstrom had making over $2M more for all those griping about Franzen but defending Lidstrom (yes, I mean you, rook).

    To me, Nash isn't worth the money.

    wingfanjim

  • GRR Spartan said...

    Turd is a bit harsh but what this season showed us is older players take longer to heal and even midseason injuries to older players affect into the playoffs.

    I don't think Illitch will cut Lidstom's salary by 50% so unless Lidstrom decides to hang it up the rebuilding won't be as dramatic as some might hope.

    Turd by Wing standards. This is a organization that wants to compete for cups and tries to gear itself as a cup contender year in and year out. By Wing standards, this year was a disappointment...aka a turd.

    I agree that Illitch won't do it because he is uber-loyal, but he should.

    wingfanjim

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