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about the AR-15 that you believe it should be banned? In other words, what features does it possess that makes you want it banned?
It's a semi auto assault rifle, ban all semi auto rifles and semi auto shotguns. He hit 27 people with it, 26 of them died, that's a very deadly weapon. He was able to fire 100+ rounds in several minutes. Give him a bolt action 30/30 and he probably only kills 5-10 kids. The AR-15 has no hunting use, it's not powerful enough to kill a deer at range consistently, it's only purpose is to fire as many rounds as quickly as possible at close range. Rapid firing is what turns these tragedies into large scale massacres, the perpetrator killed himself when 1st responders arrived so the number of victims was directly related to time in this and most other instances.
What is the purpose of this type of weapon? Home defense? Against whom? Are there highly trained assault squads breaking into houses that need to be guarded against? These types of guns serve no legitimate purpose outside of compensating for the small penis size of its usual owners. I'm also curious to know the capacity of the magazines he was using for his assault rifle.
We don't allow people to have fully automatic machine guns, why? If you're arguing for assault weapons then why not for machine guns? What's the difference? They both have one purpose, to kill as many people as quickly as possible. The paranoid gun nuts have got to come to their senses, things need to change. Doesn't mean people wont be able to hunt or keep arms for home defense, just that this whole paranoid fantasy that someday these gun nuts will be called upon to lead tactical teams to defend America with these types of weapons needs to end. It's childish and harmful.
This post was edited by Johnny2x2x 16 months ago
I for one don't want someone with one of these semi-autos breaking into my home.
I also think we need to look at magazine capacity for semi auto hand guns.
No one is advocating repealing the 2nd amendment, but it's high time e had some more sane laws about the types of weapons people may own.
And I'm sure they'd just magically disappear if they were banned and therefore you'd never have to worry about anybody doing such a thing...I mean it's not like there's thousands and thousands of these weapons our own government just shipped to gangs in Mexico that wouldn't end up back here to be sold at an inflated price due to its high demand and low supply, right?
And of course if they had been banned and were super expensive, it's not like this killer in Connecticut's mother had a lot of money and would have been able to afford it in the blackmarket....
This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by fallenangle 16 months ago
1) Most hunting rifles and shot guns are also semi-automatic. If you ban teh AR-15 because it is is a semi-automatic, you will also have to ban the tens of millions of hunting guns laready in peoples homes. For obvious reasons, this will never ever happen.
2) The AR-15 absolutley has a hunting use. It is the #1 varmint hunting gun. the reason is because it shoots a small bullet very accurately at long ranges - like 1000+ feet. You're statement that it's only purpose is to shoot as many rounds as quickly as possible at close range is patently 100% false.
3) These types of guns (semi-automatic guns) absolutely serve a purpose. As I said earlier, they are the most popular hunting gun in the United States. Every hunter I know uses a semi-auto for hunting.
4) Ah, now here is where the problem is, IMO. Large capacity magazines are more the culprit than theguns themselves, IMO. State law for hunting is that I can't have a magazine that can hold more than 5 rounds. If large capacity magazines (10 or more rounds) were outlawed, it would help more than banning the actual guns. Look at all of the mass shootings over the last 20 years or so. They all ghave one thing in common. It is not assault rifles, or semi-automatic rifles. It is they all used large capacity magazines - even for the handguns. Check out this article:
bingo... as i think i have said from thread to thread. extended magazine rounds need to be banned as part of any solution.... is there any situation where you need a round of 30 when 10 would be more than sufficient?
Have all the guns you want - just ban the ammo.
They will be like polaroid cameras.
Why don't most of these massacres involve machine guns then? Machine guns are surely more effective and are surely still out there and being used by criminal elements? Hell, I've known people to modify semi autos to become fully auto. Why not machine guns? Because by making fully autos illegal we have severely limited their availability to the general public. Adam Lanza would have surely used a fully autmoatic machine gun if he could have gotten his hands on one, but he couldn't so he used the semi auto AR-15 which is widely available. If the AR-15 was illegal it would have been much harder to get and Lanza and the countless other mass shooters would have been forced to use a deer rifle or at worst a pistol or two. Still would have been a terrible tragedy, but not on this scale and the victims might have had time to flee if he had had to spend more time reloading.
Hell, if you have the money you can get an RPG, but we don't see RPG attacks as part of these mass killings because they are illegal and thus much less widely available. As for the weapons curently in circulation, do a buy back program, it will take some time, but eventually these types of weapons will be much harder to procure.
These types of weapons serve no legitimate purpose in our Country outside of making some weekend warriir gun nuts feel like they are tough and ready for the impending collapse of society. It's childish bull shit and it's got to stop.
Them 20 dead kids are just a price of our freedom! Don't take ma guns given to me by our founding fathers!
The idiot status quo
AR-15s might have a hunting use, but can it be replaced by a less dangerous weapon? Most hunting rifles and shotguns are not semi automatic, most hunting rifles are bolt action and most shotguns are pump action. We must not know the same hunters because I can't think of any I know who use semi automatic rifles for deer. I would guess that a semi automatic .22 caliber might be good for squirrell or rabit, but isn't a pump action 20 gauge shotgun the weapon of choice for small game?
And even if there are legitimate hunting uses, so what, some hunters might be inconvenienced by having to use weapons that aren't as rapid fire. Big whoop, for their legit hunting purpose I'm sure there are still literally hundreds of other effective choices of weapons to pick from that can't be used as effectively for the mass slaughter of innocent people.
I agree with you on magazine capacity.
The only thing that would make it less dangerous is if it were not semi-automatic, and as I said, there is no way in the world banning semi-autos is feasible. I've been hunting for 35 years, and while back in the day, semi-autos were not popular, they are prevelant today. I don't have any stats to prove it, but I would be surprised if semi-autos did not comprise at least 75% of gun sales over the last 20 years.
The problem I have with gun bans is that people don't know what the hell they're talking about most instances. They show a pic of an AR-15, and people freak out, when the only difference between that and my remington 1100 30.06 that I use for deer hunting are aesthetic things. The AR-15 looks menacing, but to be honest, my 30.06 is a more dangerous weapon because it shoots larger bullets just as fast.
Old western six shooter - one pull of trigger, one round fired
Modern day revolver - one pull of trigger, one round fired
Semi-auto pistol - one pull of trigger, one round fired.
Semi-auto rifle - one pull of trigger, one round fired.
You see the pattern, whether if one is in the wild west using a six-shooter, or using one of today's firearms, it is the capacity to fire as many rounds as quickly as possible that make these weapons of mass destruction.
These are not needed for defense, no one is ever attacked by more than a single individual and no one ever misses with a single shot.
Question authority. Power to the people
So what your argument basically boils down to is, "We need semi-automatic weapons because they're the most efficient tool for killing things," right?
This post was edited by Omar Comin19758 16 months ago
All but one of the mass killings since 1950 occurred in a "gun free" zone.
These kids die for freedom but lack of it.
They died for the left's fantasy that passing a law prevents evil.
Last week up until Friday morning we would have said the Mrs. Lanza, the shooters mom who he shot while she slept, was a responsible gun owner who registered her weapons.
Post shooting we should ask why she had an AR-15 and two pistols with 100's of rounds of ammunition that her special emotional needs / diagnosed Asperger's son had access. I understand a single woman wanting a pistol for home protection but multiple pistols and an AR-15 and take the son shooting to teach him how to shoot?
I'll wait for the official report on how many rounds were fired, how many he had and how many magazines that had room for more than the standard 5 shot magazine that is standard on the Bushmaster AR15 "Varminter" series.
This is a perfect example of the futility of gun bans. You already acknowledge criminal elements use machine guns. Why? Because they can't purchase the legal guns available, which would be just as effective to achieve their goals, since most have criminal records. The reason these massacres don't involve them is because nobody had a criminal past and thus could. Why would they purchase something illegally when A) it would be illegal and that alone would risk them getting caught and not being able to carry it out, and B) The costs would be much much higher since it would be purchased on the black market. So you correctly point out that criminal elements will always be able to get access to banned guns, so obviously anybody would be able to. It has nothing to do with limited availability due to a ban, they're still being produced because law enforcement and the military requires them
Isn't ROF an issue. I mean an AR-15 fire way more shots per minute than a Glock even if both are Semi-Auto.
This post was edited by Eggy 16 months ago
"A) it would be illegal and that alone would risk them getting caught and not being able to carry it out, and B) The costs would be much much higher since it would be purchased on the black market"
You make my point for me. Everything you just said makes a case for banning some types of guns.
Your assumption is that if they were illegal they wouldn't try to seek them out on the black market? Let's see, I can point to drugs, prostitution and human trafficking as illegal activities that aren't deterred by its illegal status, what are your examples that would support your position?
a semi-auto is not a hunting gun. the most accurate guns in the world are all bolt-action, so saying a semi-auto .223 caliber is a varmit gun is ridiculous. the sick fuck had a chance to take his mother's Enfield bolt-action rifle, and left it at home in favor of the semi-auto Bushmaster.
let's get this straight, a .223 is not the same thing as a .22 caliber. the .223 has a larger bullet and a whole lot more powder behind it. It was designed to have maximum lethality for armed forces. you take an AR15 and i'll take a .22 bolt action, and i bet i hit more varmits than you, every time.
Sure a ban will take time, there are a lot of guns in the system, but we need to start sometime. Nothing gets done if you don't make a start. If you want to keep one for show, then it has to be disabled and the barrel filled with lead.
The shooter also had a Glock 20 SF, a 10mm handgun issued to conservation enforcement to shoot large game like grzlly and polar bears which was allegedly used to kill himself and a Sig-Sauer he was carrying.
Reportedly the Bushmaster AR-15 was used to kill all the children in the classroom. CBS radio reported today that the 6 year old boy, Noah Pozner, who is being buried today was shot 11 times.
Bushmaster AR15 Varminter comes with a 5 shot magazine.
You're right. The system is working to perfection.
so fallenangle... whats your solution? honestly a serious question... unless you don't think there is an issue....
fallenangle is an agent provocateur, he doesn't have answers, just demeaning and snarky comments.
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