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We all know the liberals hate these GOP budget proposals. But I would like to know how Libs would actually get to similar numbers of 5.3 trillion in cuts, saving or tax revenues to get a handle on the massive deficits. Do you have ANY real ideas other than taxing millionaires and billionaires. Because those taxes could be part of your plan but wouldn't come anywhere close to raising 5.3 trillion.
Or is your plan to continue to bury your head in the sand...not proposing and budgets (like the libs in congress) and hope that somehow the problem just goes away all by itself. Here are the hard facts...if we don't do anything we will add another 10+ trillion to the debt by 2022 (and that is the rosy projection assuming 5% growth in the next few years). Which means we are at least 25 trillion in debt by then..which is similar to Greece's situation. At that point, we will be forced to deal with it by serious measures..massive cuts, massive unemployment and a depression. Is that you desired solution in order not so have to cut any spending on entitlements?
So what is your plan?? I am really curious. Lets see the alternative to the GOP plan. The GOP at least working on a plan to get the problem somewhat under control. What is the demm plan? Specifics please. Don't just say higher taxes on the wealthy..(because that wouldn't come close to raising enough money to offset 10 trillion in new debt).
Oh..and here are some details of the GOP plan..what actually gets cut.
A look at what the Republican budget would mean, specifically, for programs around the country.
Here is one plan and you are free to disagree with it or continue to pretend it doesn't exist all you like.
I found my post humorous... but a bit of a hijack. Out of respect for lars, as he seems like a good dude and posts well-informed stuff... I deleted my sarcastic take on the state of the union.
This post has been edited 6 times, most recently by xsanguine 2 years ago
We need to press pause on the war machine.
I don't care if the candidate that stands for that is a republican or democrat or independent. My votes for the rest of my life are going to whoever solemnly swears not to hemorrhage money on stupid wars.
Honestly -- nothing else matters. 50 years from now we'll still be arguing like idiots over abortion, gay marriage, healthcare, taxing the rich, etc. The keywords and rhetoric might change a little but we'll be in exactly the same place. One govt. will 'solve' an issue, the subsequent govt. will 're-solve' the issue in the opposite manner, and so-on-and-so-forth, and we'll be in the exact same damn place. The only question will be whether we have pissed away 50 trillion dollars on war in the meantime, or saved ourselves the trouble...
This post was edited by TheAxMan 2 years ago
So I take it you won't be voting in this lifetime.
Welcome to the club.
Another key component that I tend to think is related to what you mentioned is the money that is involved in our political process.
Politics is entertainment for profit (as evident by all the bullshit "news" shows). By nature it's hard to trust people's intentions when they're motivated by profit.
Yup...the press ignores this very logical Progressive Budget...raising taxes and reducing the amount spent on Defense are the basic things that must be done...
This post was edited by TrapperGus 2 years ago
Lurking on tRCMB since 1996
That is of course the logical thing to do since lowering taxes on upper incomes and 2 unfunded wars are what caused the Great Recession in the first place. But doing the logical thing isn't in the conservative agenda. They think just doing more of the same old same old will fix everything.
Where are the further cuts to defense?
Where's the end to the farm subsidies, the oil subsidies, the alternative energy subsidies?
Ryan's entire plan involves defunding things that benefit the majority while catering to the military-industrial complex and multinationals.
Defense needs to slashed...needless wars need to be stopped.
Let lars rage and when Romney has to embrace this budget that cuts Medicare and gives more tax breaks to those at the top he'l flip or he'll lose..
What lars never wants to address is why can't we have increased revenues in addition to spending cuts. But then folks like lars can't get more taz breaks although we have the lowest tax rates in 60 years.
So why is it the only way we can decrease the deficit effectively is by giving those at the very top more tax reductions?
lars, how about you talk about Sweden. You remember Sweden, the country with higher taxes than Great Britain and a large social safety net. Harping about Greece is right from the GOP handbook and I am beginning to wonder why lars just doesn't link his campaign info directly to the board.
Almost every developed nation in the world was walloped by the financial crisis, their economies paralyzed, their prospects for the future muddied. And then theres Sweden.
Can you explain how this budget reaches the claimed numbers? Also doea obama support it?
I don't know if I like the ryan plan. My point is that the gop is trying to put out real budget proposals to debate. The demm? Well they haven't produced a budget in 3 years.
I see the "peoples budget" who put that out? Do demms support it ? If so why doesn't the senate adopt it? Or at least we should be debating the plans
What about Sweden lars? All we hear from you is Greece, Greece, Greece. The US isn't in the EU.
The reason you love this budget is you give up nothing. Those at the bottom? Too freakin bad they are at the bottom, they need their taxes bumped but those at the top need to keep those low rates because in your world government revenue can't be considered in deficits.
Sweden's GDP in 2010 was 5.5%, US was 2.9% yet Sweden has health insurance and unemployment for their workforce.
cut defense budget
slowly eliminate Social Security
legalize drugs & tax
increase income taxes for higher income families
tax multi-billion dollar "non-profit organizations"
East Lansing- A Drinking Town with a Football Problem
You boob... I don't care about Sweden. Sweden can take care of Sweden. I asked what your plan was to reduce the deficit by 5.3 trillion or more over ten years. You give me some crap about Sweden. If you love what they are doing please tell me the specifics as it applies to America. How much are tax rates? How much is cut and where? How much revenue is generated? and what is the total savings and revenue gain to get us on a long term path to solving this mess. If you can't provide that kind of data...then shut up about Sweden.
How much is slashed? What are effects of that? How does that save 5.3 trillion over ten years and eventual gets us to balanced budgets in 15 years?
Its easy to say cut defense or tax millionaires and billionaire. But that really doesn't save enough or produce enough to make a dent. For example, the 30% tax on millionaires and billionaires that Obama has been touting as his solution only produces some 3 billion in new revenue over a year. That hardly solves a 1.6 trillion dollar annual hole.
You keep talking about Greece like its the US so I'll bring up Sweden.
Sweden the country that isn't playing the austeruty card and the country with a 5.5% GDP.
Austerity, program cuts and tax cuts for the wealthiest 10% and 1% don't fix everything except they do grow deficits
Sorry I can not take anything that Paul Ryan says seriously. I have met the guy a few times and I have no idea how he can put this budget together, I doubt he could do long division if you put him on the spot. He is old school pay to play politics. I doubt he has a original idea in his head.
Here is a synopsis of Ryan's plan:
With this budget, Republicans choose to be the tribunes of the 1%. They send the bill not to the banks that blew up the economy or the wealthy that enjoyed the party, but to the elderly, the middle class and the poor. Consider:
'¢ Cut Taxes on The Rich. At a time of extreme inequality -- with the top 1 percent capturing a staggering 93 percent of all income gains in 2010 -- Republicans would dramatically lower taxes on the wealthiest Americans and, by definition, raise them on working families.
[Ryan isn't candid enough to admit to that, of course. He extends the top end Bush tax cuts, cuts top income tax rates to 25 percent, sustains lower rates on wealth (capital gains, dividends, millionaires' estates) while claiming the reforms will raise as much money by eliminating loopholes and tax breaks that he refuses to specify. But the only way to raise enough money to do that is to go after the biggest deductions -- limit the mortgage deduction for middle class homeowners and/or cut the tax benefits for employers provided health care. The first would add to housing woes; the second would lead more employers to stop providing health care. Both reforms that would directly hit working families.]
'¢ Cut Health Care for Millions. With health care costs soaring and employers cutting back on health insurance benefits, the Republican budget would add millions to the rolls of the uninsured by eliminating the Obama health care reforms, with no program in its place.
'¢ End Medicare as We Know It. With boomers headed into retirement and soaring Medicare and Medicaid costs driving projected deficits, we have to get health care costs under control. But instead of taking on the drug and insurance companies and the hospital complexes that drive up costs, the Republican budget would end Medicare as we know it, requiring seniors to pay more. When today's 55-year-olds retire, they would discover that Medicare has been turned into a voucher or "premium support" program that will not keep up with health care costs, forcing them to pay thousands more out of their own pockets. The Republican budget would also cut Medicaid support drastically for the most vulnerable -- the impoverished, the disabled, and the terminally ill.
'¢ Cut Access to College. With college tuition soaring and more and more people being priced out of the education they have earned and need, the Republican budget would solve the problem by cutting back on student loan and grant programs. They would ration college admission by income rather than by merit.
'¢ The Poor Pay for Deficit Reduction. And with poverty rising, the Republican budget would require that the poorest and most vulnerable Americans bear much of the burden of reducing the deficits that exploded when Wall Street blew up the economy. (Although, again, Republicans don't admit which domestic programs would take the hit. But, by reducing spending on domestic discretionary programs by one third in 10 years, they insure devastating cuts in everything from Head Start to education to disease control.)
'¢ Let America Decline. With our basic infrastructure -- from roads to schools to sewage systems -- in dangerous decline, the construction industry flat on its back, and interest rates near record lows, Republicans call for spending less, not more, on rebuilding America, costing jobs, and rendering our economy less competitive and putting more lives at risk.
'¢ Make the World a Tax Haven. With global corporations growing ever more adept at using transfer pricing and overseas tax havens to avoid taxes here at home, Republicans would make the entire world outside the U.S. a corporate tax haven, ending any taxation on profits reported abroad, encouraging companies to move jobs and book profits abroad.
'¢ Pad the Pentagon. With the U.S. spending almost as much on its military as the rest of the world combined, Republicans demand that we raise, not pare, Pentagon spending.
The Austerity Trap
Ryan's Republican Budget has one other fundamental message -- that America must turn its attention immediately to the "crushing burden of debt." Ryan would cut spending by over $500 billion in the first two years compared to the president's budget, while claiming to lower taxes by about $131 billion. That takes nearly a 2 percent of GDP boost out of an economy growing at about the same rate. Ryan brags that the Republican budget reduces deficits faster and lower than the president's budget. (Although given that he won't reveal how he pays for over $4 trillion in tax cuts and what programs would take the spending cuts, that is far from proven.)
Lost in the race for austerity is the reality that we desperately need jobs and growth. Although the economy has started to generate jobs, 25 million Americans are still in need of full time work. We have fewer jobs than we had a decade ago, and millions more people. This debate should be focused on jobs, not cuts.
Ryan and Republicans duck this by arguing that austerity will increase confidence, and "job creators" will get to work. But we have seen how austerity works in Europe, now teetering on the edge of recession. It not only costs jobs; it makes deficit reduction harder. Ryan's budget assumes a rate of growth that his spending cuts and layoffs are likely to undermine.
Of course Rep Ryan is being coy. The last time he was upfront about his plans the GOP NY 26 candidate readily endorsed his plan only to see herself trailing in the polls and doing a 180 at a presser called in a seniors center less than 72 hours before the special election.
Do you honestly think Romney who has made back tracking on the campaign trail an art form is going to tell the typically solid GOP seniors voting block he's going to screw with Medicare?
I can't take credit for that...just pasted part if the article.
The rest of it is interesting as well.
Paul Ryans Republican budget is revealing, but not flattering. Even by Washington standards, this is a remarkably dishonest document. It claims to be serious, but offers targets that are simply preposterous. It calls for leveling with the American people, but cravenly ducks laying out who will pay for top end tax cuts. Ryan would invest in policing the world and protecting the tax havens of multinationals, and turn the Dream into a fantasy. The Ryan budget stands with the 1%. The Congressional Progressive Caucus with the rest of us. You get to choose.
Wow you are not that dumb are you?
Did Republican Congressman put out independent budgets while Bush was in office? Fuck no!
Did Democrats put out independent budget ideas while Bush was in office? Hell yeah!
So now that Obama is in office, we have the opposite.
Let that roll around in your head a bit and see if you can figure out why that may be. It shouldn't be that difficult for you if you're a quarter smart as you claim to be.
I love all the criticism of the GOP plan. But nothing about specifics of how demms and obama would solve the problem...which was the question I asked in the OP.
Sounds like a lot of dodging. Meanwhile. Demms in the senate have yet to pass a budget 3 years running.
This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by lars 2 years ago
Ive seen a few other budgets posted here. What are you looking for? Do you want someone to break it down Barney style for you? Why would anyone take the time to break down the entire budget, write up a solid report with figures, when in the end you will deny the numbers and simply attack the other side?
Its comical that after 6 years of GOP drive by budgets (2001-2007) and fighting wars with off budget expenditures lars is now all about specifics.
Its the new GOP talking poin. We say what we are going to do no matter the costs. Like we should all line up like automotons behind a goof like Ryan whose bought and paid for by 2 brothers in Texas and their cronies.
Golly lars, after 30 years of waiting for Dr. Laffer's trickledown to work all we see is a shrinking middle class and more laws and court decisions allowing them that have to get even more.
Funny, I don't recall the government shutting down these last few years, so a budget had to have been passed.
Yet lars is claiming the Demms haven't passed a budget......hmmmm...
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