Online Now 2331

Wells Hall Off Topic Board

This is your pulpit to preach to the masses about everything from politics to religion

On this Board 137
Record: 3425 (1/27/2013)

Online now 2302
Record: 10351 (3/11/2012)

Boards ▾

MSU Red Cedar Message Board

The largest and most active MSU Spartans board on the web

The Press Box

The place to ask questions to SpartanTailgate's recruiting experts

Duffy Daugherty Forum

"The Duff" is dedicated to Michigan State football recruiting discussion

Jack Breslin Forum

"The Bres" is dedicated to Michigan State basketball recruiting discussion

Wells Hall Off Topic Board

This is your pulpit to preach to the masses about everything from politics to religion

Marketplace & Ticket Exchange

The place to buy, trade or sell Michigan State tickets

Fantasy Sports Forum

For fantasy football and other fantasy sports discussion

Test/Feedback Forum

Reply

Sam Harris: In Defense of Profiling

  • I'm curious to take Wells Hall's temperature on this issue. I wholeheartedly agree with Sam. He links to a couple youtube videos in this blog that I found absolutely disgusting. This is the sort of bullshit that sometimes makes me wonder if the terrorists haven't already won.

    The best revenge is living well.

    In Defense of Profiling : Sam Harris

    Sam Harris, neuroscientist and author of the New York Times bestsellers, The End of Faith, Letter to a Christian Nation, and The Moral Landscape.

    www.samharris.org

    http://www.aip.org/history/einstein/essay.htm

    iCameron

  • There are more non Muslim terrorists in the US than Muslim terrorists. Might want to change the profile you are looking for.

    Study shows more non-Muslim terrorists in U.S. | Homeland Security News Wire

    http://www.homelandsecuritynewswire.com/study-shows-more-non-muslim-terrorists-us

    www.homelandsecuritynewswire.com

    Johnny2x2x

  • Nitro Biscuits said...

    We do profile regardless of what anyone says. Two reasons. Unconscious bias that we all carry and because all the descriptions of known terrorists match a certain profile.

    I'm glad we pretend not to profile though and do the random searches. Couldn't care less if some people are inconvenienced from time to time.

    So you think we should keep doing this?

    Play

    TSA Nabs Suspected Al Queda Terrorist At C...

    This video was taken in in the spring of 2010 at either O'Hare or Midway Airport. A toddler in a wheelchair is stopped by the TSA at the Airport in Chicago and forced to into a sequestered area. On his way to a family vacation in Disney, this 3 year old boy is in a body cast for a broken leg. Despite assurances from his father that "everything is ok", he is physically trembling with fear while he watches his two siblings, mother, father, grandfather and grandmother pass through along with everyone else...only to be singled out. He simply does not understand what is happening and why. http://www.MattOnAir.com This video was taken in in the spring of 2010 at either O'Hare or Midway Airport.

    http://www.youtube.com/v/YNO-AzPxS4U

    http://www.aip.org/history/einstein/essay.htm

    iCameron

  • Johnny2x2x said...

    There are more non Muslim terrorists in the US than Muslim terrorists. Might want to change the profile you are looking for.

    That is interesting. I will say that the study limited it to Muslim-Americans vs. non-Muslim-Americans, rather than simply Muslims vs. non-Muslims. It also said:

    The Triangle Center notes in its report that with “Muslims comprising about 1 percent of the American population, it is clear that Muslims are engaging in terrorism at a greater rate than non-Muslims — though at a low level compared with overall violence in the United States.”

    I would be in support of changing and/or expanding the profile for maximum efficiency, but the way things are now is unacceptable to me.

    http://www.aip.org/history/einstein/essay.htm

    iCameron

  • I profile.

    MasonDelhiGuy

  • Nitro Biscuits said...

    Again.. don't care one bit. Poor boy in wheel chair can cry away.

    Why are you glad about this though? Who is helped by swabbing a little boy in a wheel chair for explosive residue or whatever the hell the goal of that was? You're glad that a TSA agent should lift up his shirt and swab his cast? What are the benefits to such actions? Do they outweigh the negatives that that child had to endure?

    This post was edited by iCameron on 5/2/2012 at 11:46 AM

    http://www.aip.org/history/einstein/essay.htm

    iCameron

  • Profiling works if you're trying to stop a % of terrorist attacks. We aren't trying to stop a % of terror attacks though, we are trying to stop 100% of terrorist attacks. If they know a certain group will not be searched at all, there is no doubt that group will be used to carry out an attack, the terrorists aren't stupid, they are constantly looking for patterns and holes that they can exploit.

    Johnny2x2x

  • Johnny2x2x said...

    There are more non Muslim terrorists in the US than Muslim terrorists. Might want to change the profile you are looking for.

    What? Who are these nonmuslim terrorists and what is source?

    Συν ται η επι ται! Syn tai e epi tai! Ή ταν ή επί τας! E tan i epi tas!

    CVSpartan

  • Nitro Biscuits said...

    Yes they do outweigh it and by a massive amount. The guise of impartiality is valuable and secondly who would make a good unwitting carrier for an explosive device? Perhaps a toddler in a wheel chair. Cry away little fella. You'll get over it.

    I agree with the majority of your posts. However, this time you are sooooo wrong.

    Madhatter536

  • It's always surprising to me that people miss the point of terror - it's not the attack, it's the threat of attack. Pulling off an attack adds some credibility to threats, but the purpose of terrorism is to change, in some deep and fundamental way, the target of the threats. So if you're Al Qaeda, they want us to change our foreign policy, to get out of Afghanistan and Iraq, to leave the Islamic world. We respond to an attack by launching costly and rather pointless wars, we build an internal apparatus that responds to fear by sacrificing personal liberties and common sense, and we're leaving Iraq and Afghanistan, all in the shadow of the Arab Spring. What exactly have we won?!

    P.S. I give credit, once again, to Representative Paul, who is the only candidate who speaks out against the governmental overreach that is the TSA. As is true on a number of issues, he's too soon and too blunt, but that doesn't mean he's wrong........

    "An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind." --Gandhi

    Heathens 87

  • Nitro Biscuits said...

    Yes they do outweigh it and by a massive amount. The guise of impartiality is valuable and secondly who would make a good unwitting carrier for an explosive device? Perhaps a toddler in a wheel chair. Cry away little fella. You'll get over it.

    So what are these benefits, exactly? So far, you've only named the guise of impartiality. Not impartiality, the mere guise of impartiality. I don't find that to be so valuable that it renders invasive searches of small children an absolute necessity.

    http://www.aip.org/history/einstein/essay.htm

    iCameron

  • Johnny2x2x said...

    Profiling works if you're trying to stop a % of terrorist attacks. We aren't trying to stop a % of terror attacks though, we are trying to stop 100% of terrorist attacks. If they know a certain group will not be searched at all, there is no doubt that group will be used to carry out an attack, the terrorists aren't stupid, they are constantly looking for patterns and holes that they can exploit.

    This is an interesting, possibly valid concern. What is the probability that if we don't randomly search small children that terrorists will find ways to plant bombs on other people's children? Can we at least agree to limit searches of children to only children accompanied by people who are in any way suspicious? By all means, search everyone's bags. But I find it completely over the top to be patting down and swabbing children. I don't even have a problem with a close inspection of the wheelchair, but that level of scrutiny to a child's person seems excessive to me.

    http://www.aip.org/history/einstein/essay.htm

    iCameron

  • CVSpartan said...

    What? Who are these nonmuslim terrorists and what is source?

    http://www.loonwatch.com/2010/01/not-all-terrorists-are-muslims/

    Papa Shango

  • Papa Shango said...

    http://www.loonwatch.com/2010/01/not-all-terrorists-are-muslims/

    Where are all the alleged Right Wing extremists? Are they supposedly included in the 16% all others?

    Yet 29% are extreme left wing or communist terrorists.

    No tea partiers?uhoh

    Συν ται η επι ται! Syn tai e epi tai! Ή ταν ή επί τας! E tan i epi tas!

    CVSpartan

  • CVSpartan said...

    Where are all the alleged Right Wing extremists? Are they supposedly included in the 16% all others?

    Yet 29% are extreme left wing or communist terrorists.

    No tea partiers?uhoh

    nobody said anything about right wing. Your question was who are these nonmuslim terrorists and I provided you a link. Is every nonmuzzie a right winger now?

    Papa Shango

  • Nitro Biscuits said...

    I've had the "which side has more terrorist crazies" argument before. It sucks and everyone loses.

    Fuckers willing to kill innocent people suck no matter what they believe.

    truth

    Papa Shango

  • Papa Shango said...

    nobody said anything about right wing. Your question was who are these nonmuslim terrorists and I provided you a link. Is every nonmuzzie a right winger now?

    That was a general comment. I did not mean to imply that you said that. A lot liberals have been waiving the bloody shirt of dangerous right wing extremists since the OKC bombing.

    Συν ται η επι ται! Syn tai e epi tai! Ή ταν ή επί τας! E tan i epi tas!

    CVSpartan

  • Sam Harris' follow-up blog:

    On Knowing Your Enemy : Sam Harris

    Sam Harris, neuroscientist and author of the New York Times bestsellers, The End of Faith, Letter to a Christian Nation, and The Moral Landscape.

    www.samharris.org

    http://www.aip.org/history/einstein/essay.htm

    iCameron